Author Topic: For the Love of Photographic Syntax  (Read 3329 times)

Flippy

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For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« on: April 20, 2017, 06:46:46 AM »
I made the mistake of posting this on a camera forum earlier, so I'm reposting it here on a photography forum.

Syntax in the context of art refers basically to the technical production of a work and its inherent effects. For example: watercolors, oil paints, and charcoal all require different materials and techniques, and therefore the effects each produce are different - even if the same artist working in the same style uses them to record an identical scene. Photography, as should be obvious to everybody on this forum is the same way. There are effects which are inherent to photography, but not to other mediums. Motion blur, film grain, light leaks, etc.

It is interesting to note that in the early days of art photography, many sought to imitate the effects of other mediums in their work - but now we find those working in other mediums often seek to imitate the effects of photography!

Now, every single photograph is a product of photographic syntax, and therefore contains photographic effects. However, some of these effects are more noticeable than others, and what interests me are those which are most peculiar when compared to natural human vision or other mediums. Especially those that make the viewer aware of the mechanism of photography. A lot of photographers aim to avoid these (because they can make the image appear unreal, apparently by reminding the viewer that an actual person with an actual camera made them, some of these effects are considered to be the photographic equivalent of breaking the fourth wall) - but I find many of them more interesting than annoying.

Image dump follows:

Bicycle by Berang Berang, on Flickr

Peace Street by Berang Berang, on Flickr

Narita by Berang Berang, on Flickr

Tower by Berang Berang, on Flickr

saab by Berang Berang, on Flickr

sale by Berang Berang, on Flickr

Great Wall by Berang Berang, on Flickr

Hero Alarm Clock by Berang Berang, on Flickr

wall by Berang Berang, on Flickr

tree by Berang Berang, on Flickr

overpass by Berang Berang, on Flickr

water by Berang Berang, on Flickr

chilled steel by Berang Berang, on Flickr

Untitled by Berang Berang, on Flickr

foot scratch by Berang Berang, on Flickr

What interests me is which effects photographers generally agree are undesirable, and which effects photographers either have resigned themselves into accepting as unavoidable, or have simply brainwashed themselves into no longer noticing.

I would love to see everybody post examples of their own favorite photographic effect "anomalies".

02Pilot

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2017, 01:37:35 PM »
I find myself separating this into two categories: how I look at the work of others, and how I look at my own.

For someone else's photographs, I am willing to accept a broad range of photographic techniques, from the conventional to the bizarre, if the end result is appealing to me. Many of these approaches are far beyond what I would attempt in terms of deviations from straight photography; the impact of the end result is what matters to me, regardless of how a particular photographer got there. That said, heavy-handed post-processing - a sort of modern-day pictorialism - is almost always unappealing.

In my own work, I'm pretty restrained in terms of using "effects" (not a great term, but the best I could come up with) for the most part. I like to subtly isolate subjects with depth-of-field when appropriate, occasionally shoot contre-jour for flare and low contrast, and maybe a little long exposure motion blur every now and again. Beyond that, my work is relatively straight and focused primarily on form and subject. I'm dissatisfied on a certain level if the photo suffers from technical "effects" that I did not envision and purposely invoke, even if the end result is interesting. "Happy accidents" are always somewhat frustrating to me because they are uncontrolled and thus unrepeatable.

Any man who can see what he wants to get on film will usually find some way to get it;
and a man who thinks his equipment is going to see for him is not going to get much of anything.


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Sandeha Lynch

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2017, 01:48:47 PM »
It's a good question.  What is undesirable for me is anything that renders my ideas less clear.  For example, I can use a good light leak or an accidental double exposure, but maybe not in the same image - the one might distract from the other.

Here's a double exposure that was certainly not intentional.  In fact, I had no idea that someone had partially used the roll before I loaded it - it was from a gift batch of old film.



It's a couple of weird shapes, but it doesn't mask any of the essentials of the photo, and perhaps even assists with a hint of unintended motion.

But then, I still have a real preference for lens-driven focus blur, and these are very much intentional aberrations, whether partial or total. 





The meniscus lens suits my (internal) vision.

jojonas~

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2017, 02:23:37 PM »
yes, oh yes!

be in odd looking characteristics from the lens with how it depicts things out of focus
in a selfie mood by jonas lundström, on Flickr
a walk in the park by jonas lundström, on Flickr

shooting into the sun
Äpple delivery! by jonas lundström, on Flickr
sun is coming by jonas lundström, on Flickr

or showing off the tactileness of the medium in processing
trip kentmere selfie by jonas lundström, on Flickr
driving through the forest by jonas lundström, on Flickr

not recording a still image but movement over time (things or camera moving)
in the woods by jonas lundström, on Flickr

making wrong feel right in mistreating the film and letting it show
LC-A <3 EFKE by jonas lundström, on Flickr

or just going all out :D
heatwaves by jonas lundström, on Flickr
heat waves by jonas lundström, on Flickr
/jonas

jharr

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2017, 03:58:01 PM »
I think I disagree with Sandeha. Not that 'stacking' effects is wrong in principle, but just that I tend to find it desirable. Here is a photo that has color shift, out of focus background with a little odd 'bokeh' spot, some fog at the upper and lower borders and of course my favorite 'film technique', grain. I have to tell you that this is nothing close to what the keyboard 'looked' like, but it is pretty close to how I 'saw' it. I depend on many of the 'brushes' that are at our disposal as film photographers.


K1000-Eterna-017 by James Harr, on Flickr
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Indofunk

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2017, 04:02:29 PM »
Like 02Pilot, I will accept more "effects" in others' works which I would not in my own. For example (unlike Andrej) post-processing. I really don't mind some creative post processing or even some (gasp!) tasteful analog effects on digital photos. What I can't abide is HDR, or at least over-the-top HDR (which is apparently the only type of HDR these days ::) ).

For my own work, I normally don't choose to use razor-thin DoF all the time, but shooting in dark nightclubs as often as I do, many of my pictures are close-focused at f/1.7, so I can't avoid it ;D Also on the subject of gig shooting, I do like some blown-out stage lights, and I've come to appreciate the extreme contrast that comes with shooting Tri-X @1600. Other than that, I think the only photographic tropes I use are backlighting subjects, and then of course cross processing and double exposing.


Lounge Keyboard by Satish Indofunk, on Flickr


The Shadow Knows by Satish Indofunk, on Flickr


Damn tourists. by Satish Indofunk, on Flickr

Oh, and I'll certainly take "happy accidents" :D


Magical mystery cojon by Satish Indofunk, on Flickr

Bryan

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2017, 06:39:19 PM »
My favorite is the Kodak Hawkeye with a flipped lens:
Riley Closeup by Bryan Chernick, on Flickr

With the right subject some messed up long expired film can work:
Drum in a Lake by Bryan Chernick, on Flickr

Sometimes light leaks work but usually I don't like them:
Cormorant Drying its Wings by Bryan Chernick, on Flickr

I think this one was better because it has a little bit of grain.  Expired color film cross processed in Beerenol:
Grainy Snow by Bryan Chernick, on Flickr

Cross Processed expired color film in Rodinal (1:100 semi-stand), scanned in color:
Masts & Rigging by Bryan Chernick, on Flickr

At least the smear was in the right place with this first generation IP film
Space Needle by Bryan Chernick, on Flickr

A little color shift and grain from expired film doesn't bother me.  This is 24 year out of date 110 film:
Magnolia by Bryan Chernick, on Flickr

Jeff Warden

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2017, 09:28:50 PM »
What a great thread.  I don't have images to add but I'm really enjoying looking at, and thinking about, these. 

imagesfrugales

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2017, 11:53:00 PM »
What a great thread indeed! I enjoy all contributions. That's what filmwasting is about. I appreciate the whole bandwidth from "fine"(?) art to low-fi trash.


eleganza
by Imagesfrugales, on Flickr


green field site
by Imagesfrugales, on Flickr
« Last Edit: April 20, 2017, 11:57:52 PM by imagesfrugales »

Kai-san

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2017, 06:19:55 PM »
More lo-fi thrash, shot with The Last Camera using seriously expired and underexposed Konica Centuria 100S.
Kai


If you want to change your photographs, you need to change cameras.

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Late Developer

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #10 on: April 22, 2017, 10:18:04 AM »
I've come to the conclusion that I'm a "documentary" photographer - which was "confirmed" when a nice chap manning the RPS stand at the Photography Show at the NEC had a look at the content of my website.  This possibly accounts for the fact that I get annoyed when what I've photographed doesn't come out anything like it looked at the time and/or how I'd visualised how I wanted it to look. This is an example taken some years ago in Cambridge (I think) with a Holga - a camera I've seen other people use very well but with which I really struggle.

This is the best I can muster from a very underexposed negative.

"An ounce of perception. A pound of obscure".

chris667

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #11 on: April 22, 2017, 11:47:42 AM »
I love an accident. For me the joy of photography is I don't know what I'll get until the film's processed, and that it's unrepeatable. That's why I started losing interest in photography as digital cameras took over. For me, everything starts to lose its value when it is repeatable without effort. I think that's why I got into playing music at about the same time I stopped listening to it on the radio; when there is more brilliant music than you could possibly listen to in a lifetime available in a little box in your pocket, it's not half as special!

Saying that, I do have an idea of the look I am after when I am out with my camera. And I've recently become aware that my eye for an image is very much constrained by my understanding of the syntax of photography. Recently, I have been going out for photography walks with an artist who makes pieces predominantly in textiles, and has training in fine art.

She knows very little about the technical bits of photography, but some of her images are extraordinary. Perhaps understanding the medium you are working in isn't always an advantage.

Still, here are some of mine.

Sandeha Lynch

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2017, 10:22:22 PM »
Ooh grain!

Well then, I should add what I do if I find that very, very old film has gone on the turn.  I just eff it up some more in post-proc.  If the shot is a cute one, for whatever reason, then it's a good one whatever.




jojonas~

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2017, 02:10:20 PM »
in grain we trust...


beep beep beep by jonas lundström, on Flickr

flipped lenses sure are fun from time to time :)

up by jonas lundström, on Flickr
/jonas

imagesfrugales

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2017, 06:29:56 PM »
Ooh grain!


Fantastic shot, Sandeha.

"In grain we trust." Yeah. Amen.


sky
by Imagesfrugales, on Flickr



man with horse
by Imagesfrugales, on Flickr
« Last Edit: April 24, 2017, 06:35:50 PM by imagesfrugales »

Late Developer

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2017, 10:00:03 AM »
I really like that blue one with the sun in the sky, Reinhold.  Made me think about this shot - from a Filmwasters trip to Dungeness a few years ago - so I did a cyan job on it via Silver Efex Pro and I don't think it's come out too bad.

"An ounce of perception. A pound of obscure".

hookstrapped

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2017, 11:23:48 AM »
Cool thread...


light blur



Gakkenflex with the aperture ring removed



positive scan of Fuji FP100C negative



cross-processed montage

Blaxton

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2017, 02:41:27 PM »
This thread is loads of fun.

My contribution:  Palimpsest.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/willblax/

There are some enterprises in which a careful disorderliness is the true method. -- Herman Melville

imagesfrugales

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #18 on: April 26, 2017, 05:48:08 PM »
Yes, it's an amazing thread. Sharpness is a bourgois concept (HCB)....


triathlon impressions 1
by Imagesfrugales, on Flickr


roaming jazz gang
by Imagesfrugales, on Flickr
« Last Edit: April 26, 2017, 05:53:35 PM by imagesfrugales »

jharr

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #19 on: April 26, 2017, 09:52:22 PM »
Yes, it's an amazing thread. Sharpness is a bourgois concept (HCB)....

So is shadow detail.


N2020-BWCN-004 by James Harr, on Flickr
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jojonas~

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #20 on: April 27, 2017, 09:27:27 AM »
...and "natural colors" too? :D


traveler by jonas lundström, on Flickr

more unclean negs...

Barcelona preview by jonas lundström, on Flickr

and distorted views of the world

Our little world by jonas lundström, on Flickr

and why settle for just one or a few exposures? I heard color neg likes overexposure :D

Guess how many shots! by jonas lundström, on Flickr
/jonas

Flippy

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Re: For the Love of Photographic Syntax
« Reply #21 on: May 18, 2017, 03:21:46 AM »
This is one of my favorite threads on any photo forum now. I'll add two more contributions.

Untitled by Berang Berang, on Flickr

Untitled by Berang Berang, on Flickr