Author Topic: We're all doing it all wrong!  (Read 3982 times)


kentish cob

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2015, 09:43:09 PM »
He's a larger than life character, for sure.
You can't deny the fact that Lik gets out there and takes a nice photo. And his photographic roots are firmly analogue (Fuji 612 / 617 etc), although I'm sure I've seen more recent pics of him toting high end Canon dslrs.
I do feel though, that his major talent is in self promotion (or should that be self-aggrandisement..?)
Humble artist he most definitely is not.
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Francois

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2015, 09:59:19 PM »
Well... somehow he reminds me of Thomas Kincade...

But in the end, Lik's the one laughing all the way to the bank.
But on the other hand, money doesn't buy you love and happiness... something he seems to not understand...

He's 55 and doesn't seem to have family or anything. Right now he's got a successful business but it's all dependent on a single person. If for some reason he stops producing new work, his company hasn't got a leg to stand on.
Francois

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hookstrapped

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #3 on: February 22, 2015, 10:41:35 PM »
He could always buy his old work cheap on the secondary market and re-sell it to new buyers at exclusive prices.

jharr

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2015, 01:23:32 AM »
I don't know, but he seems like the type who might "anonymously" bid $6.5M on one of his own photos just to say he holds the record. It had to be a PR coup. I'm cynical though.
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kentish cob

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2015, 08:09:12 AM »
Glad I'm not alone in my cynicism. Seems a dark lonely place in here sometimes..!

I read somewhere that the "anonymous buyer" spent a total of around $9.5million on Lik's work.
Of course, as the sale was not through a recognised auction house, and the buyer remains anonymous, there's no independent verification... make of that what you will, but yeah... I agree with jharr, smells like PR.

Whilst I don't think anyone has openly questioned the authenticity of the claimed sale, I do detect some serious "eyebrow raising" ??? in the interviews I've seen with gallery owners and autioneers.
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charles binns

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2015, 08:10:02 AM »
Good luck to him - he clearly has the measure of the art market and the nouse to exploit it.

I wouldn't pay that much for a photograph but then again I don't have that kind of money. 

As an old Mexican actress once said "Money can't buy you happiness but it sure calms the nerves".

hookstrapped

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2015, 02:09:48 PM »
I guess they are "nice photos" - garish idealizations of nature and a pastoral past.  I think much more interesting than the photos is the market for stuff like that, and similar landscape photos.  They remind me of the photos, captioned with trite inspirational phrases, my dentist plastered on his exam room ceilings when I was a teenager.  Maybe that has something to do with the pain they evoke in me.

Francois

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2015, 02:20:35 PM »
One of the things that strikes me is the opaqueness of the whole organisation.
He claims he does editions of 995 prints. But who has the power to verify this?
I'd really like to bring together in a gymnasium all the people who bought one of his prints.
Francois

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Bryan

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2015, 04:45:53 PM »
What did the person get for his $6.5 million, a really nice signed print?  I just don't see the value unless he purchased exclusive rights to it.

Indofunk

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2015, 04:47:37 PM »
Wow, that guy seems like an A #1 tool. But as they say, don't hate the player, hate the game :) I hope that he's able to buy some really nice expensive stuff with all that money he's going to bring into the afterlife  ::)

Bryan

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2015, 04:52:12 PM »
Wow, that guy seems like an A #1 tool. But as they say, don't hate the player, hate the game :) I hope that he's able to buy some really nice expensive stuff with all that money he's going to bring into the afterlife  ::)

He's obviously playing the game pretty good.  I'm sure you will find self promotion with any great photographer, if you just put your photos in a box like Vivian Maier nobody is going to pay you for it.  In her case someone else is promoting it and making a fortune.

jharr

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #12 on: February 23, 2015, 05:49:19 PM »
I wouldn't really expect many on this forum to "get" this guy. I know I don't. I get the general feeling that Filmwasters are generally doing this for the fun and creativity (and in some cases science) of film photography, and not because of the 7-figure sales. I did break into the 4-figure arena for shooting a wedding once, but decided it was more like 'work' than 'fun', so I don't do that anymore. Now I'm going to go shoot some flowers with my Fed-3 loaded with Dacomatic Copy Film and save them for the next time Francois posts a freakin densitometric formula!
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Bryan

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #14 on: February 23, 2015, 09:15:28 PM »
Quote
Perhaps the biggest believer in the Peter Lik fraud is the photographer himself. "I'm the world's most famous photographer, most sought-after photographer, most awarded photographer," he told the Times. While he can't deny artnet's figures and his non-existent resale market, Lik does have an excuse. "It's like a Mercedes-Benz," he said. "You drive it off the lot, it loses half its value."

That was a dumb thing to say if you're trying to promote your own work.

Francois

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #15 on: February 23, 2015, 09:18:57 PM »
Personally, with all the media attention he's getting, I'm sure the IRS has people looking into his books right now. And if they don't maybe they should.

I have doubts that 15 galleries, albeit well located ones, could produce a volume of sales in those numbers.

And I also wonder how many print 995 there actually are. Usually, the people with the amount of money his pictures command at his shops are more shrewd than that!

I can't believe people don't google him before laying down the cash...

If we compare to someone else who was big on self promotion like Weegee who self proclaimed to be world famous, Lik takes it to a whole other level.
Francois

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hookstrapped

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #16 on: February 23, 2015, 09:42:38 PM »
Personally, with all the media attention he's getting, I'm sure the IRS has people looking into his books right now. And if they don't maybe they should.

I have doubts that 15 galleries, albeit well located ones, could produce a volume of sales in those numbers.

And I also wonder how many print 995 there actually are. Usually, the people with the amount of money his pictures command at his shops are more shrewd than that!

I can't believe people don't google him before laying down the cash...

If we compare to someone else who was big on self promotion like Weegee who self proclaimed to be world famous, Lik takes it to a whole other level.

The difference with Weegee is that he produced some good punk compared to Lik's muzak.

Francois

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #17 on: February 23, 2015, 10:13:42 PM »
People just love Muzak... the company wouldn't have survived for so long if it wasn't the case!

And it inspired a bunch of very important bands. Devo did make an easy-listening album. And the Girl from Ipanema has a very important place in the Blues Brothers movie  ::) :P

This is something that always amazes me. People just seem to love blandness. They prefer microwave lunches to home cooked meals. They choose a car that is cheap over one that is fun to drive. They decorate in beige. They hire the person with as much personality as a trout. They keep the default background on their computers. They try and avoid flashy colors in their clothes.

These are Lik's and Kincade's customer base.
Francois

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limr

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #18 on: February 24, 2015, 02:12:44 AM »
People just love Muzak... the company wouldn't have survived for so long if it wasn't the case!

And it inspired a bunch of very important bands. Devo did make an easy-listening album. And the Girl from Ipanema has a very important place in the Blues Brothers movie  ::) :P

This is something that always amazes me. People just seem to love blandness. They prefer microwave lunches to home cooked meals. They choose a car that is cheap over one that is fun to drive. They decorate in beige. They hire the person with as much personality as a trout. They keep the default background on their computers. They try and avoid flashy colors in their clothes.

These are Lik's and Kincade's customer base.

^^^A thousand times this!!
Leonore
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ManuelL

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #19 on: February 24, 2015, 07:33:51 AM »
I had to watch this one again after reading the Lik article - to get it out of my system  :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xs3PMEKD0-c&list=PL1803FA6E13049709&index=12

Late Developer

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #20 on: February 24, 2015, 09:06:47 AM »
People just love Muzak... the company wouldn't have survived for so long if it wasn't the case!

And it inspired a bunch of very important bands. Devo did make an easy-listening album. And the Girl from Ipanema has a very important place in the Blues Brothers movie  ::) :P

This is something that always amazes me. People just seem to love blandness. They prefer microwave lunches to home cooked meals. They choose a car that is cheap over one that is fun to drive. They decorate in beige. They hire the person with as much personality as a trout. They keep the default background on their computers. They try and avoid flashy colors in their clothes.

These are Lik's and Kincade's customer base.

I agree, Francois. Most like to feel "part of the herd" as there's perceived safety in numbers.

In my opinion, this guy has no more talent than any of his peers.  What he does have is more front than Blackpool and a highly effective and, by the sounds of it, quite forceful PR / Marketing team. Can we blame him for doing what he does?  Probably not - certainly no more than the likes of Simon Cowell and any others who try to persuade us to listen to what they have to say.  Ultimately, who is the bigger fool; the fool who leads or the fools who follow?  My dad used to tell me that "self-promotion is no recommendation" and I believe he was absolutely spot on.  We have no-one to blame as much as ourselves if we allow anyone to persuade us to part with money for something we really don't like.  If we really do like it, however, it's just a question of how much and how deep are our pockets.
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Francois

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #21 on: February 24, 2015, 02:56:25 PM »
For some odd reason, when I see people like that, they somehow remind me of some odd cult gurus...
Essentially the type of people I stay away from.
Francois

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Hungry Mike

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #22 on: February 24, 2015, 04:47:38 PM »
Quote
In my opinion, this guy has no more talent than any of his peers.  What he does have is more front than Blackpool and a highly effective and, by the sounds of it, quite forceful PR / Marketing team.
I think that is exactly it. He has a decent grasp of the technical aspects of his art but no more than any of his peers or frankly some of us here. His art is that he knows his audience, knows how to sell to it & what his market will bear.

Quote
This is something that always amazes me. People just seem to love blandness.
Don’t underestimate mediocrity. Whether it is for comfort, convenience, peer pressure, or being part of a “herd” it is an incredibly powerful instinct or motivation in our culture. You see it in many aspects of our western culture – from a lame sitcom that lasts more than a decade, a middle of the road movie that make millions, to mass produced fast food on every corner & convenience food in every home kitchen, to the bland & unchallenging art that wouldn't be out of place in your grandmother’s living room. While I certainly, in my youth, raged against that stuff but as I enter middle age I recognise its appeal. Frankly it is likely easier to sell a Peter Lik in Las Vegas then it is to sell, say, a Roger Ballen. As my dad would say “A nice steak is great but sometimes you just want a peanut butter sandwich.”

Or another way to look at it - given time something bland & boring can become cool. Like this supposed pristine 50's kitchen:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/27212557@N05/sets/72157623429185132/#
I'd kill for a kitchen like that now but as a teen I'd likely think it looked bourgeois or square.

Maybe the cool kids a generation from now will want to have Thomas Kinkaid & Peter Lik pictures!


« Last Edit: February 24, 2015, 05:47:17 PM by Hungry Mike »

Bryan

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #23 on: February 24, 2015, 05:35:53 PM »
Or another way to look at it - given time something bland & boring can become cool. Like this supposed pristine 50's kitchen:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/27212557@N05/sets/72157623429185132/#
I'd kill for a kitchen like that now but as a teen I'd likely think it looked bourgeois or square.

I was looking at that same kitchen a few days ago, my wife and I live in a mid century ranch and love that stuff.  It's amazing how well preserved that kitchen is.  Our house is like a 50's - 60's museum, we remodeled our kitchen to that style as well.  Almost all our furniture, stereos, art, cameras, etc. are from that era.  We're even having a 1960's themed cocktail party this weekend.  We've gone a little over the top but it's a lot of fun.

SLVR

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #24 on: February 24, 2015, 05:48:38 PM »
Just another capitalist taking people for a ride. I believe its unethical, but everyone who says that the art isn't the image itself but the way he manipulates the market is correct.

the guy sounds like a douche.

Jeff Warden

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Re: We're all doing it all wrong!
« Reply #25 on: February 24, 2015, 06:24:37 PM »
Peter Lik's record was very short lived.  Last weekend I shared a portrait of a cute neighborhood kid on the weekend thread.  Yep, I sold that print today for 175 million. 

To an anonymous buyer.

 8)