Author Topic: Flattery, or something else? You Decide (Read 4401 times)

Ed Wenn · « **on:** November 22, 2011, 10:36:56 PM »

Team, I'm going to let you lot decide whether this is merely a coincidence, or something else. It's not a huge deal, but it's worth highlighting I think.

Reprinted in full below (including formatting where possible) is an email we received today in the Filmwasters mailbox from the Lomo Lot about their latest competition. Like a lot of photo sites we get regular emails from the Lomo Lot and recently they even asked us to partner with them in some initiative of some sort...I forget what. We declined politely on the grounds that we're independent and don't want that to be brought into question by associating ourselves with any commercial organisation. So far, so cordial.

Anyway, check out this email and see what you think. I smiled at first, but the more I thought about it (especially the inclusion of those Australian mug shots), the more irritated I got.

Here's some source material with dates:

http://www.filmwasters.com/forum/index.php?topic=3747 (February 01, 2011)
http://www.filmwasters.com/forum/index.php?topic=3761 (February 05, 2011)
http://www.filmwasters.com/forum/index.php?topic=3762 (February 06, 2011)
http://www.filmwasters.com/collaborations/v/collaboration23/ (March 2011)

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Dear Editors, We’d like your feedback! We are doing something different, we’re introducing you to the sections in which our featured article is located so that you may understand better why we do what we do! Lomography Series Captivating images introduced by our int’l team of writers! The team at Lomography puts on running series’ based on topics, photos or people who have something in common. We serve to a background of the photographs as they can be historical, feature a too young to recognize celebrity, or a newcomer in the arts scene! Featured Series– By the Decade This month we are featuring Mug Shots of the famous as well as of all else based on the decade in which they were shot. This Chronologic approach allows readers to note the change in style and format of ‘the mug shot’. Dehumanizing, or perhaps to a larger than life celebrity – humanizing, our fascination with mug shots is indeed something to explore. Lomography Rumbles Competitions to suit your every blinking, shuttering, clicking endeavor! We ask you to upload analogue photos based on the theme. A list of requirements are featured in the rumble announcement such as ‘how many photos each user is allowed to upload’. Prizes are listed for the winners and often other entrants! Featured Rumble – Crime-Free Mugshots Rumble Whether you are curious about finding our if you are among the stars who look good in their mugshots – which isn’t that great a thought to have in the first place – or if you’ve been told one too many times that your passport, driver’s license and other official photos of you look like mugshots, then it’s time to peak your curiosity and give in to your calling with our Crime-Free Mugshots Rumble!

Details:

Prizes: 1 grand winner of 20 piggies and 3 runners-up of 10 piggies each.
All winners will also receive a special award badge for their LomoHomes.
Film/Camera Type: Any analogue photo not digitally enhanced or manipulated.
You may do a simple crop and joining of photos however.
Upload limit: 3 photos!
Minimum Photo Dimensions: Must be at least 768px in either width or height.
Meta data must be completed (camera, film, location & 3 tags).
Deadline: December 16, 2011.
Actual “mugshots” will not be accepted.

We would appreciate you letting us know if you reblog this information and should you have any questions please contact me at her.name@lomography.com.

Francois · « **Reply #1 on:** November 22, 2011, 10:52:10 PM »

Well... it does have a definite feeling of déjà vu.
I just hate copycats...

I see why it looks strange to you... I've just got an email from them telling me that unless I spend at their shop I will loose the few piggy points I have... Just another plot they think will bring me to their shop...

Mojave · « **Reply #2 on:** November 22, 2011, 10:58:32 PM »

I got the piggy loss email too.

So Ed, is it the fact that those mugshots were posted here on the FW forum and the fact that it led to a collaboration that's bothering you? Im thinking that's correct and yeah, I find that very annoying.

Ok, I think I just answered my own question by looking at the topic subject. Yeah, I think its something else myself. They snagged content from FW's and are using it for themselves. I mean, like you said, they even grabbed the mug shots.

sapata · « **Reply #3 on:** November 22, 2011, 11:01:46 PM »

He he...
Looks like the filmwasters crowd are quite few months ahead of the game!

Quote from: Francois on November 22, 2011, 10:52:10 PM

Well... it does have a definite feeling of déjà vu.
I just hate copycats...

I see why it looks strange to you... I've just got an email from them telling me that unless I spend at their shop I will loose the few piggy points I have... Just another plot they think will bring me to their shop...

HA! Me too...
Not enough to drive me to the shop though... but I have to say the Diana Mini and the new Lomokino movie maker are on my list

Skorj · « **Reply #4 on:** November 23, 2011, 12:17:26 AM »

I've no idea what a piggy is, but I do know if you steal from one person it is 'plagiarism', but if you steal from many it is 'research'.

Lomography Society have been doing their research well for years. Their whole existence is based on taking someone else's concept. Certainly annoying in one way, but flattering in another that we led. I care not really, this is the internet after all. Skj.

gothamtomato · « **Reply #5 on:** November 23, 2011, 01:59:46 AM »

Years ago I was the director of a photography workshop program that was connected to a camera store here in NYC. I used to have all kinds of original photography workshops, taught by some terrific photographers not teaching anywhere else. ICP (The International Center of Photography) used to regularly copy my workshops. Usually a season or two after I offered a class (or a teacher) for the first time, their catalogue would suddenly add it.

I found it pretty amusing because ICP is such a snooty organization, (and it was no skin off my nose since I didn't own the workshop program I directed). And I once actually approached them (ICP) with an idea for a class, for myself to teach, and they turned me down then added the class to their catalogue but had someone else teaching it.

You find copycats in the darndest places!

Flippy · « **Reply #6 on:** November 23, 2011, 04:01:38 AM »

I don't think the mugshot theme is particularly unique, I've seen other groups do mugshots. Even ones that didn't have anything to do with photography. After all, mugshots are a pretty widely known photographic phenomena.

If they did indeed get the idea from here, they probably got it from five other places too.

Ed Wenn · « **Reply #7 on:** November 23, 2011, 09:01:20 AM »

Quote from: Flippy on November 23, 2011, 04:01:38 AM

I don't think the mugshot theme is particularly unique, I've seen other groups do mugshots. Even ones that didn't have anything to do with photography. After all, mugshots are a pretty widely known photographic phenomena.

Clearly the idea of a mugshots themed event is hardly something we have a copyright on or were breaking new ground in pursuing...in fact even when we ran that collaboration I wondered to myself, "Hmmm, how many times has this been done before?". So, no argument there. It's the combo of the mugshots competition (in their case) being inspired by the vintage mugshots from Australia which is what turned my head. Now that is quite a coincidence.

Quote from: Flippy on November 23, 2011, 04:01:38 AM

If they did indeed get the idea from here, they probably got it from five other places too.

That's probably true too. Either way, it just shows that on occasion, even the Lomo Lot have very good taste.

Francois · « **Reply #8 on:** November 23, 2011, 02:59:16 PM »

Just for that, they should give us a rebate code and discount at their shop

Coveman · « **Reply #9 on:** November 23, 2011, 10:38:23 PM »

even with a discount, i still wouldn't be able to afford any of their over-priced plastic!

carolmikkelson · « **Reply #10 on:** November 24, 2011, 05:13:27 PM »

Quote from: Francois on November 23, 2011, 02:59:16 PM

Just for that, they should give us a rebate code and discount at their shop

Maybe they'll give you some piggies $:-\$

Diane Peterson · « **Reply #11 on:** November 25, 2011, 03:40:25 PM »

ED, I am in total agreement with your statements..
Having worked as a textile and clothing designer for many years I am more than a little aware of the copying thing..I would sell a piece to someone only to find a couple months later they had 100% imitated my designs to the smallest detail and then put there label on..so yes, I have strong feelings about this sort of thing..

Abdul Hye · « **Reply #12 on:** November 28, 2011, 07:19:27 PM »

Glad to see someone getting emails from them. I emailed them regarding an issue and haven’t got a response. Contacted them through facebook and still no response. I will have to confront them at their store.

They are more about “lifestyle” than photography.

LT · « **Reply #13 on:** November 28, 2011, 07:30:00 PM »

@ctrlclick00 I had a similar problem with them about 10 years ago. I had to telephone an Austrian number (this was long before they had actual shops everywhere), and try to communicate to get a refund on a broken camera they sent me. I vowed never to so business with them again. I'm amazed that they are still the same 10 years on!

Francois · « **Reply #14 on:** November 28, 2011, 09:34:45 PM »

I guess it depends with who's on the other side of the line. When I bought my Sprocket camera, I had a free shipping code and there was a bonus when the bill was over a certain amount. Since they didn't have the gift item in stock at the Toronto store, they upgraded my order! Shipping was plenty fast. So no complaint there...

Service is just like their quality control: random

al · « **Reply #15 on:** November 28, 2011, 11:38:43 PM »

After they hijacked WWPD and publicised it as "The Lomographic Society Presents World Pinhole Day" a few years back I don't think I'd be suprised by anything!

gregor · « **Reply #16 on:** November 29, 2011, 02:59:17 AM »

I set up rule in my e-mail program: all e-mail containing the word Lomo gets deleted automatically. did I forget to say I truly and whole heartedly love Lomo & the 10 golden rules ?

Francois · « **Reply #17 on:** November 29, 2011, 03:31:14 PM »

I too have a rule for Lomo. Good thing these things are so easy to make by now with Thunderbird!
Mine end up in a "Photography" folder that is set to keep messages for only 30 days... plenty long.

Ken B: eyes, I just do eyes. · « **Reply #18 on:** November 30, 2011, 01:09:19 PM »

I just walk away from their BS

Abdul Hye · « **Reply #19 on:** December 01, 2011, 12:44:02 AM »

I want to like them. They bring out interesting products which are a little over-priced. The sales staff don’t seem to know much more than what’s written on the box. Their website never seems to work properly. When I was given a voucher code and told them it didn’t work I was told keep trying as there are always problems with the site. I tried using their new LomoKino camera and there are 17 frames missing out of 141 frames. Something has gone wrong with their scanning process. On both rolls of film there about 15% of the frames missing and it’s cropping out a quarter of the image. And a few other issues.

I want to like them and tried a number of their products but have been disappointed more than a few times.

charles binns · « **Reply #20 on:** December 01, 2011, 08:05:55 AM »

The whole don't think just shoot thing just gets on my nerves. My sister bought me some Lomo b&w film last year for Christmas - paid a small fortune for a box of 3 rolls of Shanghai film. What a rip off!

Ken B: eyes, I just do eyes. · « **Reply #21 on:** December 01, 2011, 09:31:56 AM »

The Emperor is nearly naked and no-one will hear what is being said.

The naive and innocent like Charles's sister are being manipulated by these charlatans into paying exorbitant prices for low quality underwhelming goods - this is what gets me upset.

To overcharge someone who is well informed is one thing "Caveat Emptor", to rip of the unknowing is shows a distinct lack of morals and a lowly opinion of your client/customer.

Their whole line of BS has become old, maybe its time for them to crawl back under the rock the came out from.

LT · « **Reply #22 on:** December 01, 2011, 09:47:28 AM »

I agree wholeheartedly with all the sentiments here, although I have a few big BUTs (!)

1. The lomographers do count for a fair amount of film usage, which is a good thing as far as we are concerned I think. Anything to support the film market is a good thing.

2. There are many here who would not have found film photography if it hadn't been for the Lomo Soc. I found the Holga through their website, and although I tend not to use it much these days, I do think that it gave me the impetus to look beyond basic record type photography and open up my vision to new ideas. It was for me like acid was for Timothy Leary

. But like most here, I soon saw through the lomo photo-wall of cool to see how much the hype outweighed the reality. Never-the-less, they did me a favour.

just a couple of thoughts - I don't like em, but I see their use. You won't catch me pulling the cord on a spinner in the near future though.

charles binns · « **Reply #23 on:** December 01, 2011, 01:16:30 PM »

Leon,

You do have a point and, whilst I stumbled across the Holga by accident on Ebay they were a useful resource when I started to get into 'lo fi' photography. I have never bought anything from their website as abit of shopping around soon shows what a rip off they are. I think the last time I looked p&p charges were £10! I can only assume for that price whatever you buy is delivered by the bloke off the Milk Tray ads!

Flippy · « **Reply #24 on:** December 01, 2011, 02:32:44 PM »

I've tried really hard to dislike lomography, but I can't. $:-\$

There's things about lomography I don't like, but I could say most of the same things for say leica. However they are putting cameras into new outlets others aren't (like urban outfitters) and they're coming out with more new cameras than anybody else is, and they're reaching market segments other companies ignore. So despite the dubious marketing claims, the "mystique"/culture and the high prices - I just can't trash talk them.

Besides, if you think the lomo folks charge way too much, have you seen the prices the recording industry asks for boring, tasteless music printed on flat pieces of plastic?

Almost anything seems like a bargain comparatively.