Topic: Tell me about Kentmere.

[Indofunk]

In my constant pursuit of films that will not break the bank, I've gone from Tri-X (used to be affordable a decade or more ago) to HP5 (used to be affordable even a few years ago) to bulk rolling HP5 (used to be affordable 2 years ago 😂) to finally noticing that bulk rolls of HP5 have gone up $40 since 2022. By contrast, a 100' roll of Kentmere costs about the same as HP5 did 2 years ago. Fomapan and Arista films are cheaper than Kentmere, but I've used those two brands and I HATE them 😂

My plan would be to push Kentmere 400 to 1600 and stand develop in HC110. Has anyone done anything similar and can share some stories/thoughts/examples with me? If not, then just your thoughts on Kentmere 400 vs HP5 vs Tri-X would be helpful 😊

[Francois]

I know Jason from Grainydays has asked the lab to push his rolls and he was really happy with the results.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-OzyvT7cd0

The Darkroom (where he gets his stuff processed) most probably didn't stand develop the stuff.

Just watch the video as he shows pretty much each picture he took on it.

[astrobeck]

GrainyDays Jason did some nice work pushing it in those derelict buildings. I'd like to see that place, mainly for that wallpaper in one of the rooms I saw.
Back to the film though....I've used Kentmere400 in my Holga with good results. I'm no help for your specific question of pushing, but it is a good price.

I stopped using Tri-x for the same reason and I love that film. It's sad...
B

[Ed Wenn]

This may be a non-topic that I resolve on my own by just buying some film, but what the heck; some input from the group is always entertaining.

The situation is that as a result of my return to regular filmwasting in the last year or so, I have done a little bit of stock taking when it comes to my film stash. I've recently bought a couple of new 35mm format SLRs and my daughter has two decent point-and-shoots that she uses frequently. 35mm film is therefore the in-demand format at Wenn Mansions. I have well over 200 rolls of the stuff, so I thought I was sitting pretty and could burn through old stock without financial outlay, but the shocking revelation is that I have no b/w film at all  Right?! Who'd have thunk it?

My question is in two parts:

• I used to like Tri-x and Efke 100 film. I'm partial to big grain. Is there any film in particular that I should have a go with? Should I just buy some Ilford? FYI, I'll be sending it off to a lab, rather than souping at home.
• Is it worth me selling some of my stash? Has any particular 20 year old film become super hip these days? I have quite a stock of Fuji E6 film for instance.

[Ed Wenn]

Oooh, I have just realised that I've sort of asked the same question on another thread. So I have just merged my thread with this one (see post above) to keep all the replies in one place.

Also, Satish...great minds etc. 

[Indofunk]

This may be a non-topic that I resolve on my own by just buying some film, but what the heck; some input from the group is always entertaining.

When I first saw this I thought I'd typed it and forgotten that I'd done so 🤣 Because, clearly the best way to answer my own question is to buy a roll of Kentmere 400, expose it at 1600, and stand develop it 😂

But as Ed said, group input is always entertaining and useful, so carry on 😊

[Flippy]

I have pushed Kentmere 400 to 800 with decent results.

Untitled by Berang Berang, on Flickr

Rain by Berang Berang, on Flickr

This is medium format, 645, developed in D76 1:1 dilution - but look at the grain! In 35mm I would probably use stock solution to keep the grain in check.

The only thing to not like about Kentmere is that it has a very weak (or non existant) anti-halation layer. If you have a strong backlight you will get veiling flare like this:
Untitled by Berang Berang, on Flickr

It's much less noticeable on medium format than it is on 35mm.
I really like Kentmere 100 as it give does a good job of recording detail in shade, it has basically a straight response curve with little toe and no shoulder, so it works well with the subjects I shoot.

[Phil Snaps]

The only thing to not like about Kentmere is that it has a very weak (or non existant) anti-halation layer. If you have a strong backlight you will get veiling flare like this

But then you don't need that expensive mist filter anymore
I really like Tri-X but yeah, it is getting really expensive now. Curious to see if anyone found some alternative.

[Francois]

I wonder if anyone has tried Orwo Wolfen 400 or Streetcandy ATM400 ?
I know the Streetcandy stuff is supposed to be quite crunchy as-is, so it's bound to be a bit too much when pushed.
But I don't know about the Orwo.

[Flippy]

I've tried ORWO UN54, 100ASA. It's a really neat film that has a look similar to the old Efke films. But two problems: it's very easily scratched (all three rolls I've shot suffered from scratches) and ORWO/filmotech packages it in these devastatingly awful non-standard plastic cassettes. These things are so frustrating to get open that anything ORWO is not up for consideration by me until they start packaging it in real metal cassettes.

I still need to try Rollei RPX400. There are a lot of claims that this is just rebranded Kentmere 400, yet there are enough differences (developing times are different, Kentmere recommends no pre-wash, Rollei recommends pre-wash, etc.) that I don't think they're identical films. RPX is coated by Harman so of course it will be similar to other Harman products, but honestly if RPX400 has an actual anti-halation layer the few pennies more it costs (over Kentmere) could be worth it.

[Kai-san]

I use a lot of Rollei RPX400, I buy it in bulk. It has very fine grain, especially when processed in XTOL or Adox XT-3 as in the example below. This is definitively not Kentmere 400.

[Francois]

ORWO/filmotech packages it in these devastatingly awful non-standard plastic cassettes.

They probably use the same cassettes as FlicFilm (the snap-together model that barely fits in the film compartment).
These are definitely not the nicest thing to use, but I guess that they're what we'll have from now on until the tin free steel shortage gets solved.

[Indofunk]

I use a lot of Rollei RPX400, I buy it in bulk. It has very fine grain, especially when processed in XTOL or Adox XT-3 as in the example below. This is definitively not Kentmere 400.

I've never shot RPX400, but I've always loved the images I've seen. And I hear it pushes well, too. Unfortunately, it's basically the same price as HP5 so I never had motivation to switch 🤷🏽‍♂️

[Phil Snaps]

I thought RPX400 was actually HP5?
Edit: according to The Big Film Database it is Kentmere 400 https://industrieplus.net/dxdatabase/rechfilm.php?name=rpx400 but this information may be outdated.

[Indofunk]

I thought RPX400 was actually HP5?
Edit: according to The Big Film Database it is Kentmere 400 https://industrieplus.net/dxdatabase/rechfilm.php?name=rpx400 but this information may be outdated.

Woah, worlds colliding 😁 If that's true, then I WILL get to shoot "RPX400" after all, in the form of Kentmere 😂

[Francois]

I was about to suggest Holga mystery film...
Have you checked with the FPP? They have a ton of funky re-spooled stuff.

But when it comes to cheap stuff, Foma and Arista.EDU are pretty much the name of the game. What I find pretty weird with those is how sensitive they are to the developer used. It's a bit like a Jeckell and Hyde film. Give it the wrong potion and it turns on you. But treat it right and it's surprisingly good. Just don't expect the silver density you see in other films.

I really need to try it at 1600 or even 3200.

[Indofunk]

Well, if you figure out a cheap film/developer combo that gives you slightly-smaller-than-baseball-sized grain at 1600, please do let me know 😁

[Francois]

I sure will 😊

[Kai-san]

Pushing film means loss of shadow detail, nothing you can do about that. If you want to avoid large grain you will probably need a fine grain developer. Adox XT-3 or XTOL works well with Fomapan 400 in my experience. Another fine grain developer is the Adox Atomal, which I haven't tested. I've also seen comments from people using T-Max developer with success, but I haven't seen any examples. Here's one who has attempted to push Fomapan 400 to 1600 ISO using HC-110:

 https://alysvintagecameraalley.com/2021/03/08/pushing-fomapan-400-to-1600/

[Flippy]

I thought RPX400 was actually HP5?
Edit: according to The Big Film Database it is Kentmere 400 https://industrieplus.net/dxdatabase/rechfilm.php?name=rpx400 but this information may be outdated.

You know, it's a little funny because there's a youtube video from a few years ago where somebody compared Kentmere 400, Agfa APX 400, and Rollei RPX 400, and concluded they were all the same film - except their own video showed that when all three were processed together in the same tank, for the same time and temp, that Rollei RPX produced different contrast from the other two. I really don't think K400 and RPX400 are the same. Agfa on the other hand, probably the same.

ORWO/filmotech packages it in these devastatingly awful non-standard plastic cassettes.

They probably use the same cassettes as FlicFilm (the snap-together model that barely fits in the film compartment).
These are definitely not the nicest thing to use, but I guess that they're what we'll have from now on until the tin free steel shortage gets solved.

Appear to be so. Two more thoughts: it's pretty absurd that a shortage of tin-free steel ever had any effect on film packaging given how little material is used by film companies, and two: plastic being plastic is another reason to avoid those terrible plastic cassettes. If I throw my old film canisters in the recycling, I know that the steel will be recycled, the plastic not so much.

[Phil Snaps]

From a Youtube comment:
"I’ve talked to Rollei about that and they’ve told me that the RPX 100 and 400 are new emulsions based on the original Agfa Leverkusen APX formulas. Produced for them by Harman Technology. They’re actually the ones who bought the Agfa Leverkusen patterns when it went down. "

[Francois]

I find it funny how so many film stocks now revolve around Harman in one way or another.

[Ed Wenn]

Thanks for all the info. I'm going to need to re-read it and see if anything jumps out at me as being the film to try. The ORWO UN54, 100ASA sounded really promising from the Efke comparison, but the scratching and those plastic cassettes don't sound like a lot of fun. I guess I'll heed Francois' words of wisdom as my jumping off point and see where it takes me. "But when it comes to cheap stuff, Foma and Arista.EDU are pretty much the name of the game"

[Francois]

So far, I found that it works pretty good with Rodinal.
But I only tried their 400 ISO film with HC-110 before. With the HC, it's really nice when exposed at EI 250, but with Rodinal you can go full speed.

Here's what you can expect from Rodinal (I hope I got the right image as the film has no edge markings)

[Indofunk]

Well, color me impressed! (Or, more appropriately, black & white me impressed 😂) Kentmere 400 performs like an absolute champ at 1600! 🏆 The lighting for these test shots was pretty good overall, so I wasn't quite testing the absolute limits of the film, but based on these results I'm confident that it'll satisfy me under almost any conditions. The grain is very pleasing, even smoother than HP5+ IMO, and it seems to be even more contrasty than HP5+, though not nearly as contrasty as Tri-X. Overall, two 👍🏾👍🏾 and I will definitely be buying a 100' roll 🤗

[Indofunk]

Oh, dev scheme: New HC110 at a 1.6:100 dilution (I found this better than 1:100 with HP5+) for 1 hour, with 4 inversions at 1/2 hour.

[Francois]

That is definitely an impressive performance on all fronts 😊

[Flippy]

So I tried a roll of Rollei RPX 100, and I don't think it's the same as Kentmere 100. I've shot and developed a lot of Kentmere 100, and this stuff came out with far more contrast than I expect from Kentmere.  Rollei's datasheet doesn't give a dev. time for D76 (weirdly) so I looked at the Massive Dev Chart, which told me 11 minutes for 1:1 dilution. Given how contrasty these turned out I looked at the dev time for Kentmere 100 in the same dilution, and they list 11.5 minutes... which would only add contrast. So if RPX and Kentmere are the same, either my thermometer is broken and the developer was too warm, or I must've agitated far more than I normally do. Grain is also less noticeable I think.

Both prints were made with the number 2 filter, but look about what Kentmere would give with a number 3 filter:

fox eye view by Berang Berang, on Flickr

Untitled by Berang Berang, on Flickr

[Ed Wenn]

Well, color me impressed! (Or, more appropriately, black & white me impressed 😂) Kentmere 400 performs like an absolute champ at 1600! 🏆 The lighting for these test shots was pretty good overall, so I wasn't quite testing the absolute limits of the film, but based on these results I'm confident that it'll satisfy me under almost any conditions. The grain is very pleasing, even smoother than HP5+ IMO, and it seems to be even more contrasty than HP5+, though not nearly as contrasty as Tri-X. Overall, two 👍🏾👍🏾 and I will definitely be buying a 100' roll 🤗

These look really good, Satish. I'll give the Kentmere a go. We have a run of gigs coming up in early July and I'll make sure to take some with me for shooting the other bands and whatever backstage shenanigans unfold.

[Francois]

We have a run of gigs coming up in early July and I'll make sure to take some with me for shooting the other bands and whatever backstage shenanigans unfold.

Are you still on the punk scene? Still playing with Sink, Johnny no Mate or Chocolate (It's pretty hard to tell after some time)?

[Ed Wenn]

The current band is called Dealing With Damage. Sink split up in 1991. Chocolate in about 1998. Billy No Mates was up until 2012. DWD is my longest running outfit I think. We don't do much because we don't have any time, but I think we've decided to stay together. Mauricio Sapata took the front and back cover shots for our last album.

[Francois]

That's super cool 😉
If you ever decide to play Les Foufounes Électriques in Montreal, I'm going to brave their bad beer, tough crowd and stinky toilets to go 😁

[Flippy]

I noticed that Arista has recently (apparently last year, but first saw it about a month ago) launched a new film, Aristapan 100. Made in Germany. Saw one claim that this is repackaged ORWO, but the development times given by Arista are much different than those for ORWO's 100 ASA film. So it's a bit of a mystery. If it is ORWO, then it's loaded into a real metal film canister, instead of one of those silly plastic ones. Still, it's nice to have another low(er) cost option.

[Francois]

And nicer to have proper metal cassettes.
I just hope they don't crimp them so they can be re-used

[Flippy]

FWIW it looks like some of the major online retailers have marked down Rollei RPX 400. Meanwhile, the prices on RPX 100 have been jacked up. Might mean the prices of RPX 400 will get hiked up after the clearances end. Freestyle has also marked down Foma 100 for a pretty good price in 120.

[Indofunk]

FWIW it looks like some of the major online retailers have marked down Rollei RPX 400. Meanwhile, the prices on RPX 100 have been jacked up. Might mean the prices of RPX 400 will get hiked up after the clearances end. Freestyle has also marked down Foma 100 for a pretty good price in 120.

Good looking out! But Kentmere 400 is still significantly cheaper than Rollei RPX 400, at least in 100' rolls. I already bought 100' of Kentmere, so I'll wait to see what film prices are like when that's finished 😁

[Flippy]

Developed my first roll of AristaPan 100 today. Film cassettes are not reusable (in fact it takes some force to get the ends off, but still better than those dreadful plastic things ORWO uses). Some comments elsewhere on the internet suggested AristaPan is relabeled ORWO NP100, which notably has low sensitivity to green, I decided to test this by using a yellow green filter, which normally takes 1.5 stops of exposure compensation... and every shot made with the filter was greatly underexposed, by what looks like two or three stops (even with the +1.5 stops of compensation). Interesting. I use this filter a lot, but will have to note not to use it with this film if I buy more. Unfiltered shots look good on the negative, no time to print them yet.