Author Topic: Packfilm reborn? (Read 5720 times)

Kai-san · « **on:** July 13, 2018, 08:26:54 PM »

It looks like 'Doc' Florian Kaps has a plan to reintroduce packfilm (Polaroid type 100) in a kickstarter this autumn, more precisely 69 days from today. Check out this link: http://savepackfilm.supersense.com/

I also happened to check the status of Catlabs project that was announced last year (I think), there is a new update there as well: http://www.catlabs.info/we-will-make-packfilm

Time to get optimistic?

Francois · « **Reply #1 on:** July 13, 2018, 08:57:57 PM »

Well, if there's a guy who can pull this off it's definitely Florian Kaps.
I don't know how he does his magic but he did bring back Polaroid film without having to beg Fuji for their Instax material...

In those days, I think we must believe in something good and both of those projects are. One of them's bound to become a success.

Faintandfuzzy · « **Reply #2 on:** July 13, 2018, 11:23:07 PM »

I need some b&w Fuji 3000

lharby · « **Reply #3 on:** July 19, 2018, 06:45:56 PM »

I am certain pack film will be made again.

IP reverse engineered integral film, which is surely more complex (well possibly has different types of complexities).

I've actually been wondering whether Kodak would be interested in reinvigorating their interest in instant film. They would certainly have the clout and they have made it in the past.

Francois · « **Reply #4 on:** July 19, 2018, 09:17:42 PM »

Though they probably still feel the burn from that experience.
When you look at how it worked, I wouldn't be surprised if they had sold their patents to Fuji at the time. They both expose the image through the back...

moominsean · « **Reply #5 on:** August 19, 2018, 03:14:57 AM »

Interesting that they use Fujifilm for the front page design. Or maybe that's all they had laying around.

Will probably be like $23 a pack at least, but better than the current $60 a pack on ebay.

Francois · « **Reply #6 on:** August 19, 2018, 02:46:08 PM »

And it's going to be fresh from the factory, not one of those desert fresh deals.

gothamtomato · « **Reply #7 on:** August 27, 2018, 05:20:53 PM »

I hope it will be able to make transfers. That's all I want from a peel apart film, pretty please!

astrobeck · « **Reply #8 on:** August 28, 2018, 10:36:55 PM »

Quote from: Francois on August 19, 2018, 02:46:08 PM

And it's going to be fresh from the factory, not one of those desert fresh deals.

but I like desert fresh.....

Francois · « **Reply #9 on:** August 29, 2018, 03:20:58 PM »

I must admit that desert fresh does have its charms

If it wasn't the case I wouldn't have a cactus grove in my bathroom and I wouldn't be on the hunt for bulk loaders containing mystery film

Kai-san · « **Reply #10 on:** September 15, 2018, 12:55:11 PM »

Yesterday CatLABS announced that they are abandoning their project to make pack film: https://www.catlabs.info/we-will-make-packfilm
I guess the limited market for these films is the main reason for this decision, and on top of that there is a new kickstarter coming up at the end of the month from Supersense. Let's hope that the machinery that CatLABS has acquired can be sold to Supersense to help their plans for making pack film.

Francois · « **Reply #11 on:** September 15, 2018, 03:38:06 PM »

I just hope they can strike a deal...

Bryan · « **Reply #12 on:** September 15, 2018, 04:29:10 PM »

The Kickstarter starts in 5 days.

http://savepackfilm.supersense.com

Francois · « **Reply #13 on:** September 15, 2018, 09:47:30 PM »

I definitely wish them good luck.

Kai-san · « **Reply #14 on:** December 05, 2018, 06:16:27 PM »

The kickstarter is out today:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1755997589/one-instant-analog-packfilm-re-invented

Possibly not what we hoped for and crazy expensive. And I'm crazy enough to back them!

Francois · « **Reply #15 on:** December 05, 2018, 09:11:49 PM »

Too bad they don't have something in the same price range as thermal paper...

grit · « **Reply #16 on:** December 05, 2018, 09:46:02 PM »

It is more expensive than I'd hoped, but I pledged anyway; I would like to see the technology survive.

MrclSchprs · « **Reply #17 on:** December 06, 2018, 06:01:40 AM »

Quote from: grit on December 05, 2018, 09:46:02 PM

It is more expensive than I'd hoped ...

Most likely the price will drop once regular production starts. I pledged and wish them all the best.

Jeff Warden · « **Reply #18 on:** December 06, 2018, 02:31:44 PM »

I wish them success, and I'd love to try this product. I'm concerned about all the waste inherent in one-shot packaging though. There is a lot of trash involved in taking just one exposure, and using eco-friendly materials doesn't solve that issue. It reminds me of the Keurig coffee pods, making trash with every cup.

I like the bespoke nature of this concept, but wonder what the long term holds in store - surely they would need sophisticated automation to make anything other than very expensive one-shots.

jojonas~ · « **Reply #19 on:** December 06, 2018, 07:06:44 PM »

this is super great news! though I wonder how they'll later make the leap from this to actually making the film material themselves

Kai-san · « **Reply #20 on:** December 06, 2018, 08:41:14 PM »

Quote from: jojonas~ on December 06, 2018, 07:06:44 PM

this is super great news! though I wonder how they'll later make the leap from this to actually making the film material themselves

It looks like they already have explored some options regarding new materials:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHaz0pogYAI

Jeff Warden · « **Reply #21 on:** December 06, 2018, 09:27:16 PM »

So if one were to use this type of film and wanted the best quality camera to expose it, what was the high water mark of camera/lens from this era?

Francois · « **Reply #22 on:** December 06, 2018, 10:28:16 PM »

Mamiya Press is probably it... though some will disagree

Jeff Warden · « **Reply #23 on:** December 06, 2018, 10:36:48 PM »

Quote from: Francois on December 06, 2018, 10:28:16 PM

Mamiya Press is probably it... though some will disagree

That's okay, I just want some leisure time browsing for my fantasies and will enjoy learning about the cameras. This film is too pricey for me and I have too many cameras but a guy can dream. :-)

If anyone else has candidates fire away!

lharby · « **Reply #24 on:** December 07, 2018, 09:41:38 AM »

Quote from: Jeff Warden on December 06, 2018, 09:27:16 PM

So if one were to use this type of film and wanted the best quality camera to expose it, what was the high water mark of camera/lens from this era?

Polaroid 600SE (this is very similar to the Mamiya Press as Francois points out).

See here: http://www.filmwasters.com/forum/index.php?topic=779.0

Other people really like the modified 190/195 (with a proper lens) but they are not cheap and if you are happy to pay the current rate, I think the press cameras are better, give you more options and probably sell for less (as the 195's are rarer). Also with the Press cameras, they are modular and have compatible film holders.

http://cjo.info/classic-cameras/polaroid-195/

I have a polaroid film back (thanks to another member on here) for my Sinar 4x5, which I would say also gives very good results.

The announcement is fantastic, I am sure it will develop like Impossible integral film. But I also hope this means that the price could drop for current FP100.

Francois · « **Reply #25 on:** December 07, 2018, 01:53:32 PM »

The only thing I don't like about Polaroid backs for 4x5 is that the groundglass shows more than the size of the room, so you have to make a special mask to compose correctly.

Jeff Warden · « **Reply #26 on:** December 07, 2018, 03:03:13 PM »

Wow that Polaroid 195 looks like a sweet camera. Thanks for the link!

lharby · « **Reply #27 on:** December 07, 2018, 04:51:32 PM »

Quote from: Francois on December 07, 2018, 01:53:32 PM

The only thing I don't like about Polaroid backs for 4x5 is that the groundglass shows more than the size of the room, so you have to make a special mask to compose correctly.

Francois I was lucky enough to pick up one of these from a user on the LF forums for very little cost

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQXl8mctxuC66Xum1o2fxyZws0smSpoDwyuHMwUsg5dWw4MK57s

Francois · « **Reply #28 on:** December 07, 2018, 10:48:32 PM »

I just measured the pack and printed the frame on an acetate... and then lost the acetate

Didn't know these frames existed... though I must say I have an old Crown Graphic that was made in the dark ages of the photographic world when wood was actually a viable camera making material and quality was actually measured in Lbs.

Kai-san · « **Reply #29 on:** December 07, 2018, 11:04:50 PM »

I agree that Polaroid 600SE and Polaroid Land 195 are probably the best. If you want one with a built-in lightmeter (automatic exposure) then the Polaroid Land 450 is one of the best out there. It's one of the latest as well so that gives you a better chance of finding one with nice bellows. Or you can do like me and put a Rodenstock Ysarex 127mm lens on an old Land 101 model.

moominsean · « **Reply #30 on:** December 19, 2018, 02:09:43 AM »

I backed it for a pack of film. Comes to about $70 after shipping, but I want them to succeed. The one shot at a time package seems a bit convoluted, but I'm sure, like anything else, it becomes second nature with repeated use. Though I'm not sure I will ever use more than one pack at those prices!

I also hope it works better than the New55. I think I spent $80 on a pack and every single shot fell apart. As soon as I would pull it, the metal tab would pop off and expose the film from the end. My other Polaroid film works fine, so it wasn't my holders.

Jeff Warden · « **Reply #31 on:** December 20, 2018, 09:11:36 PM »

Florian Kaps and his partner were on the latest Sunny 16 podcast for those interested. It was a charming interview and made me want them to succeed all the more.

grit · « **Reply #32 on:** December 27, 2018, 03:42:36 PM »

This campaign ends in 8 days, but they're only $12,000 short - seems like this project might actually happen!

Kai-san · « **Reply #33 on:** December 28, 2018, 09:58:46 PM »

Yes, they did it! The goal has been reached tonight. So many crazy people........

zapsnaps · « **Reply #34 on:** December 30, 2018, 10:10:06 AM »

I've just bought some.
If you are ever in Vienna, please pop into Supersense - it's amazing. There is a cafe in the front to park spouses/current significant others/kids/general non-believers, while you can get a dose of analogue goodness. Their mail-order service is also first class, if Vienna isn't on your immediate itinerary

lharby · « **Reply #35 on:** January 06, 2019, 12:04:18 PM »

I was wondering whether this would help reduce the current price of FP100C. But I don't suppose it will.

Still it's fantastic news.

grit · « **Reply #36 on:** February 05, 2019, 04:54:07 PM »

Small update from Supersense; timeline is on track so far, plus they now have a preorder page. I've only Kickstarted this and one other thing, the Ratio automatic pour-over coffee machine, and I've used that thing for 7 years and it's still going strong. My poor wife, on the other hand, Kickstarted the Rite Press, an unmitigated debacle. Hopefully I'm the good luck. Is anyone else really excited about One Instant? I actually don't mind the price per image so much; I'll be using it in a 4x5 camera anyway so I can't imagine wanting to make more than one image a week with it. I also really like that the cartridge is cardboard; I always have pangs of guilt at the end of every roll of FP-100C.

Francois · « **Reply #37 on:** February 05, 2019, 09:44:53 PM »

Same thing here about the leftover plastic parts. I always feel bad throwing them in the trash knowing that the city doesn't recycle polystyrene. I feel particularly bad since it's so easy to recycle. It melts at super low temperatures and dissolves easily in almost any solvent. I even thought of getting some acetone in a mason jar, breaking the plastic parts and dumping them in there. The acetone will flow over the sludge so it's easy to pour out. And the melted plastic can be used to make styrene sheets or used as a cheap varnish on projects...