Author Topic: Vivian Maier, another look  (Read 4043 times)

hookstrapped

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Vivian Maier, another look
« on: March 19, 2015, 08:59:15 PM »
http://photographsonthebrain.com/post/114065952059/thisissausage-provocations-the-almost-queering

The queering issue aside, I have to agree that the most intriguing and captivating images by Maier are of Maier, her self-portraits.  Maybe that has something to do with the circumstances of her discovery and mystery surrounding her, but I think it's in the images.  I like her other work, but her self-portraits are somehow, at the same time, out of this world and deeply human.

Aksel

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2015, 09:31:45 PM »
Thanks for sharing this interesting piece and putting the blog on my radar. Lots of goodies  ;)
Prosopopoeia, with a camera

Sid Dongre

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2015, 04:49:08 PM »
Can't say I'm comfortable with the author's ideas about her sexuality, but certainly her self-portraits are my favourite images of her's too.

There's always a quizzical, and playful look in her eyes, a childlike interest in her subject matter or it's response perhaps.

imagesfrugales

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2015, 01:41:38 AM »
"Eleanor Roosevelt, Golda Meir, Indira Gandhi, Margaret Thatcher, Condoleezza Rice, Angela Merkel, Hillary Clinton — all erotically masked and asexual in style. Maier may have been similarly opaque and uncategorizable."

That's a weird company imo for a great photographer and nanny. I like her self portraits a lot just as her "regular" work. And she's the best example why the whole copyright thing should be nuked and made new from the primeval soup.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2015, 01:43:26 AM by imagesfrugales »

Late Developer

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2015, 08:46:44 AM »
Why do people want to deconstruct her psyche? Even if they draw any "conclusions", they will only be guessing - so nothing is proven. She clearly wanted to be private in her lifetime, so give her some respect in death.  Leave the poor woman in peace, I say.   Let's just celebrate the wonderful legacy of her photos.

As for trying to pigeon-hole Vivian Maier into the company of the people mentioned in the article - and commenting on / speculating about their respective sexuality / asexuality.....!!??  It's an "interesting" article and I'm glad the link was posted (and I agree that her self portraits are intriguing in a way that the current narcissistic selfie craze can never be).  However, I'm just glad her pictures were found and not lost.

The really intriguing thing, for me at least, is how many other "Vivian Maiers" are there, or have there been, that we will never know about?
"An ounce of perception. A pound of obscure".

Flippy

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2015, 08:54:46 AM »
The really intriguing thing, for me at least, is how many other "Vivian Maiers" are there, or have there been, that we will never know about?

Probably hundreds, if not thousands.  When you consider how unlikely it was that anybody would have noticed her work in the first place, it's easy to imagine what must be huge quantities of good, old work that is mouldering away in boxes around the world, unknown, under appreciated, and with no hope of finding its way into the hands of any serious collector. 

The sort of people who look for old photos generally ignore photos like these. They're looking for historic photos of landmarks and events, and beside that point in most cases old photos either stay in the family forever or get jumbled up and lost in who knows how many other people's photos.  You might find a few really interesting ones - but you'd have no way of finding out who took them or how to find more from the same set.

Because Vivian kept her photos more or less together, and because she was distant from her family, and because a lot of photos just happened to be found by a couple of collectors who saw potential for $$$ - we all got to find out about her work. Otherwise it'd be in some attic, or out in the trash.

As for her sexuality, it seems these days that every historical person who never married is up for debate. Usually though if anybody pays attention to what people who knew them saw - they were just loners or hermits and that's all there is to it.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2015, 08:59:57 AM by Flippy »

charles binns

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2015, 09:45:14 AM »
People speculate about Maier's sexuality because they have nothing valid to say about her work. 

Such comments owe more to a "critic" making attention seeking statements than an analysis of her work and are best ignored.

It doesn't matter whether she was gay or straight -  it had no bearing on her photographic output.


LT

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2015, 10:09:18 AM »
It doesn't matter whether she was gay or straight -  it had no bearing on her photographic output.

I agree with your sentiment Charles, but I'm not sure about this last sentence ... I think it will have had a bearing on her output, given the societal norms and perspectives as the time she was photographing. Many would see her purview as highly relevant to her style and interpretation. It is impossible to know her views on gender and sexuality, but there are glimpses in her work that lead to certain assumptions. I see this as a positive thing, socially speaking. It adds to weight of influence that Maier has on the photographic and social record.
L.

calbisu

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2015, 10:18:06 AM »
I recently watched the David Malof´s documentary on Vivian Maier and I really enjoyed it. It sheds some light about Maier´s shooting style and how she interacted with the people she photographed. Equally it seems Maier was interested in showing her work to the public. All in all its a documentary well made which which I think is worth watching it. I have one of Maier´s books, the first one made by Malof. It´s missing her color photography and not displaying her most ¨iconic¨ photographs, still I like it.

C.

calbisu

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2015, 10:47:23 AM »
Just checked Maier´s site, they display some of her contact sheets, it´s nice to being able to see how she worked around with the camera.

http://www.vivianmaier.com/gallery/contact-sheets/

Sid Dongre

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #10 on: March 25, 2015, 11:17:40 AM »
It doesn't matter whether she was gay or straight -  it had no bearing on her photographic output.

I agree with your sentiment Charles, but I'm not sure about this last sentence ... I think it will have had a bearing on her output, given the societal norms and perspectives as the time she was photographing.

Absolutely, but those aspects of her personality which might be attributed to some assumed sexuality might also be attributable to many other factors.

charles binns

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #11 on: March 25, 2015, 11:43:01 AM »
It doesn't matter whether she was gay or straight -  it had no bearing on her photographic output.

I agree with your sentiment Charles, but I'm not sure about this last sentence ... I think it will have had a bearing on her output, given the societal norms and perspectives as the time she was photographing.

Absolutely, but those aspects of her personality which might be attributed to some assumed sexuality might also be attributable to many other factors.

And this is the problem - here we have the classic case of speculation heaped upon assumptions and liberally sprinkled with invention.

We have no idea what Maier's private life was like, except that she seems to have been a solitary figure, and any attempt to interpret her work based on her sexuality is purely speculative and therefore without merit.

Sorry for the rant, I just think the attempt to comment on Maier's sexuality says more about the critic trying to fill column inches than an objective critiaque of her work.

imagesfrugales

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #12 on: March 25, 2015, 12:45:37 PM »
Just checked Maier´s site, they display some of her contact sheets, it´s nice to being able to see how she worked around with the camera.

http://www.vivianmaier.com/gallery/contact-sheets/
Thank you for the link. The contac sheets are amazing. I like the portraits from India very much. Another facet of her work I didn't know about before.

Terry

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #13 on: March 25, 2015, 11:48:53 PM »
I recall a segment in the film that involved one of her former charges making some veiled allegations of physical or mental abuse, and thinking at the time that I was more interested in her relationship with her camera.  She was a hell of a good photographer--enough said!

Ed Wenn

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #14 on: March 31, 2015, 02:47:51 PM »
At a very high level this debate boils down to the age old chestnut about whether art should stand on its own, without context or back story, or whether some colour around the edges enhances one's appreciation of the work.

I can see both sides of the argument, but probably veer towards the standalone (much as I like a great rock'n' roll story to enhance my listening experience). What this particular thread has highlighted however, is how misleading the context would be if it's not actually correct. So perhaps I'm 'fully veered' and not in the process of veering  :D

Terry

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #15 on: March 31, 2015, 03:07:28 PM »
I'm with you there, Ed.  After reading Eric Clapton's autobiography I had to conclude that I'm a big fan of his guitar playing.

LT

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #16 on: March 31, 2015, 03:34:46 PM »
... After reading Eric Clapton's autobiography I had to conclude that I'm a big fan of his guitar playing.

that's brilliant ... even if after listening, you thought he was rubbish  ;D
L.

hookstrapped

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #17 on: March 31, 2015, 04:40:57 PM »
I'm with you there, Ed.  After reading Eric Clapton's autobiography I had to conclude that I'm a big fan of his guitar playing.

But no number of words can redeem his singing.

Terry

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #18 on: March 31, 2015, 07:33:00 PM »
I've learned to avoid rock biographies, with the single exception of Louise Wener's.

But back on topic, what's the real value of a lot of after-the-fact text about an artist, even assuming that most of it is in some way factual and not entirely speculative?  A friend of mine insists that the opening sequence of Kieslowski's "Blue" is in itself a lesson in film editing.  In the same way, Maier's photographs are themselves instructive without needing a lot of extraneous "explanations". 
« Last Edit: March 31, 2015, 07:38:37 PM by Terry »

Ed Wenn

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #19 on: April 01, 2015, 03:46:15 PM »
....and don't get me started on artists' statements....

Bryan

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #20 on: April 01, 2015, 04:28:02 PM »
If I judged artists by their personal lives I'd have to throw out most of my record collection.  to name a few:
James Brown, Black Sabbath, Sex Pistols, Chuck Berry, The Beatles.
And one of my favorite Blues artists  :o
Quote
Leadbelly
The Crime: The bluesman was first jailed in 1915 for assaulting a Dallas prostitute, then escaping the chain gang and living under another name until he killed a man in an argument over a woman and was sentenced to 35 years. A song he wrote begging for clemency got him pardoned, but five years later he was back in jail, convicted of attempted homicide in a similar incident.
The Time: Two years, then seven years (of the 35 year sentence), then four years.

Terry

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Re: Vivian Maier, another look
« Reply #21 on: April 01, 2015, 10:27:01 PM »
Is it time to repost the artybollocks link????