Topic: Plus X in HC-110, Rotary-processed? Advice needed

[original_ann]

Perhaps someone with devel. chemical know-how can help me out. 

I have a box of old Plus-X sheets (film code for Plus X sheets is PXT) and recently shot some.  All I have on hand is HC-110, so I'd like to find a way to use it, though the kodak publications don't give any recommendations for using when rotary processing Plus-X sheets (code PXT).   There's also a devel. time discrepancy between the PlusX Tech Sheet (7mins @ 20C) vs. the HC-110 Tech Sheet (5 mins @ 20C).

I realize Rotary processing would mean less development time so I'm considering using HC-110's Dilution H (which is twice the dilution of B) so that I can extend the development time. 

But how do I figure out how long I should develop? Normally the starting point for Dilution H is double Dilution B.  But I only have manual development times (either 7mins or 5 mins, depending which publication I look at) as a starting point.   

Anyone know a vague ballpark formula for reducing manual development times to account for the constant agitation of a unicolor drum?   Should I reduce it 25%? more? less?

This may not be ideal using Rotary Processing (much less using HC-110), but I just want to see if it's possible - - just haven't a CLUE what I should use as a starting time. 

[Francois]

I just checked my Kodak book. It has recommendations for tray processing with continuous agitation.
It recommends for HC-110 Dil. B a processing of 5 min at 68F.
Depending on how long the film has been expired for (knowing the expiry date would help), I guess it could be pretty close... at least in the ballpark. But if it's really old, you might have to process for longer.

[original_ann]

Thanks Francois.  The film is from 11/1996 

5 mins constant agitation?

I don't have enough development background to discern whether constant agitation in a tray would be equivalent to that with a bi-directional rotary processor...  Are they equivalent?

5mins seems right on the cusp - - I think I'd like to develop longer (but still unsure how to figure out what times I should use for Dilution H) - any thoughts on that?

Thanks!

[Francois]

I just calculated the film to be down to about EI50 due to the age.
That's a bit more than a 1 stop diff if it was exposed to 125ISO.
When I use my development table calculator, for HC-110 (dil B) + 1 stop, time goes up to 7:30 min with continuous agitation (68F).
Since the film needs to be pushed a bit more than 1 stop, I would be tempted to give it the full processing time anyways, even with the rotary processor. Constant tray agitation is pretty "aggressive" from the start...
Anyways, that's just my thinking right now... I could be wrong

[original_ann]

Francois - Wow your input is really helpful. 

I'm going to risk it... maybe just do one sheet right now and err for underdevelopment closer to 5mins end of the timeline vs. 7+ mins and correct upward from there.   (I'll report back when I've done everything)

[Francois]

I can't wait to hear about how it comes out!

[original_ann]

Troubleshooter, I am not...   The tonal range is very bad...  (I was under very tall shady trees with light streaming in - so contrasty).

I scanned the neg without any corrections (left) and then scanned a 2nd one with a few rough adjustments (pulling into photoshop, they look horrid!).

This first one is of a shaded pathway that had very strong evening sunlight at the opening.  It's a shame I wasn't using a smaller aperture - I think it would have helped me troubleshoot these images much more easily if more was in focus. 

I had to use the 'lenscap' method since it called for 1/15th shutter which my camera does not have and I'm sure I don't flip the lenscap on/off fast enough to equate to 1/15th sec, so to begin with, I'm sure I overexposed a tiny bit... 

There are some hot spots in the pathway - I'm assuming that I could have alleviated that had I not developed for as long (though 5mins is very short), agitated less or diluted the developer.

I should concentrate on a solution that would expand the tonal range, yes?

[Sorry, image deleted during forum software upgrade. Please re-upload if so inclined.]

[original_ann]

This 2nd one was in a more shaded area right at the outskirts of an open sunny field.  I think this was 1/30th sec - which my focal plane shutter handled. 

Again untouched on left, touched on right (and now I can see I way overdid the blacks - they look noisy)

I have 2 more to develop... not sure what I should try to do differently... thoughts are welcome! 

[Sorry, image deleted during forum software upgrade. Please re-upload if so inclined.]

[LT]

I've never used rotary processing and have never tried HC110, so there's not a lot I can say about your questions - however, all my scanned negs look like this until I work on them in photoshop ... but they print like a dream in the darkroom.  I guess it's all down to how you are planning to realise the negatives into prints?

failing that, just mix up some divided d23 and let the magic of compensation do all the work for you.

[rdbkorn]

Ann, the expired nature of the film does complicate things somewhat. My rule of thumb when doing rotary processing with a developer like Rodinal or HC110 is to deduct 20% of the time I would use with tank processing. So if I was using 10 minutes with tank processing, I'd start at 8 minutes with rotary processing.

I would also second Leon's suggestion for a divided developer. I happen to use the Thornton divided developer with Fomapan 100 sheet film with rotary processing, and it gives me a good negative for printing with a more useful tonal range than HC110 or Rodinal. Fomapan in those developers comes out with a very high contrast.

Paul

[original_ann]

rdbkorn- that was my initial conundrum so thank you for sharing your rule of thumb for 'translating' manual processing times to rotary. 

I really like the idea of a divided developer, but since this was a single box (albeit, I'm sure there's about 50+ sheets left) of expired (FREE) PlusX, I didn't want to buy a new developer just to process them.   Not that I'm married to HC-110 - - I'm not... it's just that I'm fairly new to going back to developing my own and that's just what I have on hand and don't know enough about developers to have made a firm decision which one I'd like to stick with and learn. 

I think what I may have to do, it continue developing with the HC-110 and then 'adjust' them as best as I can post scan.  I don't have a darkroom so I won't be wet-printing (or at least not right now - I'm always on the lookout for a good 4x5 enlarger!)

I just called Kodak's traditional support guy, Pete.  Unfortunately he is out until Wed. (he's really, really good) and the 'new guy' who was backing him up just doesn't have the historical experience to help.  But he suggested I email Pete and wait until Wednesday to process the rest of my sheets. 

I'm going to link to this thread so he can take a look at my sad scans and hopefully tell me what I should do. 

I'll report back later this week!