Author Topic: Trying out the EFKE 25 Ortho 4x5, ie: losing my virginity to LF(!) (Read 7935 times)

jojonas~ · « **on:** September 06, 2012, 12:07:16 PM »

Exciting stuff going on this weekend for me! I'll be joining a small group going out to the islands on the west coast of Sweden and I'll be able to loan a Sinar to shoot some 4x5 film!

So taking two birds in one stone, I decided to buy something I've wanted to try a long time: ortho film~

Maybe three birds, considering that I've haven't shot much EFKE at all. Only shot one roll of iso100 in a 127-film camera

I'm finding it hard to find good information on this film though, like what are the reciprocity characteristics? And do I need to consider how sensitive it is to UV light? I'd be glad to hear from anyone in the know here

Late Developer · « **Reply #1 on:** September 06, 2012, 01:30:09 PM »

Good luck, mate.

I'm trying to pluck up courage to get out and burn some 5x4 via my Wista as I've only used it so far with the safety net of having Leon and Paul Mitchell in attendance on a FW day out. Incidentally, I must get those sheets processed...........

sapata · « **Reply #2 on:** September 06, 2012, 04:08:43 PM »

I really hope you enjoy your day Jonas! I'm sure you're going to be hunting a LF camera to buy straight after... it's addicted!

I can't give you much information about ortho films but I remember getting from someone here when I was going to shoot some very expired 120 ortho, in the end i didn't even use the film.

jojonas~ · « **Reply #3 on:** September 06, 2012, 05:25:56 PM »

Quote from: sapata on September 06, 2012, 04:08:43 PM

I really hope you enjoy your day Jonas! I'm sure you're going to be hunting a LF camera to buy straight after... it's addicted!

that would need some saving up! hehe, hopefully I can hold off the inevitable a bit longer

if nothing else, I'll get a feel for it so I might know better what I would like to get later~

I was laready planning to take a shot or two of the people joining me, but after pokin around for ortho info I'm definetly doing it!
here's the same model shot on ortho and then IR-film:

Ed Wenn · « **Reply #4 on:** September 06, 2012, 07:55:36 PM »

Jonas, Ortho is all about the blue and the red and the lack of one or the other. I believe orthochromatic film is proper old school. It was used back in the day by Hollywood photographers to take photos of male movie stars because it made them look more swarthy and macho. It's not so good for women as it makes their skin look blotchy unless they have fantastic skin (your example shows this pretty well). I shot a roll of 35mm Ortho a few years ago and put the results up on Flickr:

http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=ortho&w=73515369%40N00&z=e

In fact here's a link to my original post about Ortho film...lots of good info from the team.

http://www.filmwasters.com/forum/index.php?topic=333.msg2854#msg2854

-----------------------------------------------------------

And here are a couple of my old snaps and some info:

Matinee Idol? by Ed Wenn, on Flickr

"Photo by Jacqui. This shot was taken using ADOX Orthochromatic 25ASA film. An old school little number used - amongst other things - by Hollywood snappers in the 30's/40's when taking promo photographs of the leading men of the day. Ortho film is blind to red and this leads to darker skin tones. It looks awful on women (unless they have great skin apparently), but on men it can add a certain suntanned, swarthy look....or so goes the common wisdom at least. After a lengthy discussion about this on the Filmwasters forum (www.filmwasters.com) I decided to try it out. I got some Ortho from Retrophotographic in the UK and set about shooting a few test rolls. I ended up (inevitably) taking loads of snaps of flowers, but I did ask Jacqui to take a few of me and guess what? It really does do what it's supposed to. This shot of me shows what I'd look like if I was darker and had bumpier skin. Very cool indeed. I sense a portrait series a comin' on over Christmas"

Tentacles #1 by Ed Wenn, on Flickr

jojonas~ · « **Reply #5 on:** September 06, 2012, 08:52:14 PM »

that's some good info (and good shots!) thanks, ed

Francois · « **Reply #6 on:** September 06, 2012, 09:08:03 PM »

The fun thing about ortho film is that you can develop it by inspection under a safelight.
That's pretty much how they managed to get so many good images in ye ole days without using an exposure meter or even reliable plates.

jojonas~ · « **Reply #7 on:** September 06, 2012, 11:57:24 PM »

Quote from: Francois on September 06, 2012, 09:08:03 PM

The fun thing about ortho film is that you can develop it by inspection under a safelight.

I know, it's great! I'm reallylooking forward to it

though I have got to remember to use a lightcoloured tray for this. the one I use mostly is pretty darkened after years of use in the darkroom (it has got character!)

Francois · « **Reply #8 on:** September 07, 2012, 04:09:09 PM »

A long time ago in an old Shutterbug magazine, they were showing a guy who made a special setup just for that.
He used a transparent glass tray (like the Pyrex we love to cook meatloaf in) that he set on a sheet of glass held to the wall with two 90° brackets. The safelight was set underneath the entire setup. That way, he could see the film develop simply by looking through it. Pure genius and yet so simple.

DS · « **Reply #9 on:** September 07, 2012, 08:04:43 PM »

Good luck over the weekend!

I like a film with an odd spectral sensitivity.

Quote from: Francois on September 07, 2012, 04:09:09 PM

A long time ago in an old Shutterbug magazine, they were showing a guy who made a special setup just for that.
He used a transparent glass tray (like the Pyrex we love to cook meatloaf in) that he set on a sheet of glass held to the wall with two 90° brackets. The safelight was set underneath the entire setup. That way, he could see the film develop simply by looking through it. Pure genius and yet so simple.

That is a genius idea- consider it stolen.

jojonas~ · « **Reply #10 on:** September 07, 2012, 08:49:05 PM »

wow! I'll have to see if I can replicate that idea~ I was thinking of using just my bike light to get as deep red as possible but I was worried it'd be dark. this is perfect

thanks francois!

Francois · « **Reply #11 on:** September 07, 2012, 11:05:16 PM »

Quote from: DS on September 07, 2012, 08:04:43 PM

That is a genius idea- consider it stolen.

That's exactly what great ideas are meant to be.

Late Developer · « **Reply #12 on:** September 10, 2012, 11:45:59 AM »

Quote from: DS on September 07, 2012, 08:04:43 PM

Good luck over the weekend!

I like a film with an odd spectral sensitivity.

Quote from: Francois on September 07, 2012, 04:09:09 PM
A long time ago in an old Shutterbug magazine, they were showing a guy who made a special setup just for that.
He used a transparent glass tray (like the Pyrex we love to cook meatloaf in) that he set on a sheet of glass held to the wall with two 90° brackets. The safelight was set underneath the entire setup. That way, he could see the film develop simply by looking through it. Pure genius and yet so simple.

That is a genius idea- consider it stolen.

Sounds great (in principle) but a word of caution - make sure that the solution in the tray above cannot spill onto the safe light below as liquids and electrics in close proximity do not make for a happy combination.....

Francois · « **Reply #13 on:** September 10, 2012, 02:16:14 PM »

good warning.

DS · « **Reply #14 on:** September 10, 2012, 08:11:10 PM »

Quote from: Late Developer on September 10, 2012, 11:45:59 AM

Sounds great (in principle) but a word of caution - make sure that the solution in the tray above cannot spill onto the safe light below as liquids and electrics in close proximity do not make for a happy combination.....

Is that why I get told off for making toast in the bath? I call it efficiency.

In all seriousness all the putative electrics on the wet side of my not quite darkroom are low voltage DC (LED safelights and a rotary processor I haven't built yet).

Also- I'll have to dig out my 'homemade-gadgets-for-the-amateur-photographer-chap' book from the '50s. It's got some bits of water + electricity kludgery in it that truly give me the heebies. The best potential Darwin award winner is a dimmer switch that basically consists of two electrodes in a bucket of salt water- you adjust the light by changing the distance between the electrodes (only move one at a time, mind. Also, try and not splash)

jojonas~ · « **Reply #15 on:** September 10, 2012, 08:16:36 PM »

ok, developed a few sheets in dektol 1+4 aaand negs are looking pretty dark. hm... :/

I forgot to prewash so that might be part of it? next chance I get I'll try stand developing in rodinal instead.

though ONE turned out pretty clear and nice... I wonder what I did with that?? (I tray developed four at a time)

scuze the super crappy pictures here. you can see what I used to photograph them off...

Francois · « **Reply #16 on:** September 10, 2012, 09:31:43 PM »

Dell makes such nice lightboxes

jojonas~ · « **Reply #17 on:** September 13, 2012, 09:48:33 PM »

so now I have been out on a largeformat adventure!
the loaned camera, a sinar studio camera for 4x5 film, was flexible and fun to use. though it could be stressful at times how long composing a shot could take. that was mostly because it was close to storm-like winds that day(!) I was always worried about losing my cloth to the winds

anyhow, it was exciting and though! being totally new to benbo tripods didn't help either haha~ but I had two good guys help me out and get to know the gear and process.

I'm surprised how sharp these are considering it was almost storm-like wind that day. specially out on the rocks!!
so without further ado, some results:

_{these are all scanned contact copies developed in undiluted dektol.}

sapata · « **Reply #18 on:** September 13, 2012, 10:15:02 PM »

Quote from: Francois on September 10, 2012, 09:31:43 PM

Dell makes such nice lightboxes

Finally, a good use of my wife's Windows OS laptop

sapata · « **Reply #19 on:** September 13, 2012, 10:18:54 PM »

Quote from: jojonas~ on September 13, 2012, 09:48:33 PM

so now I have been out on a largeformat adventure!
the loaned camera, a sinar studio camera for 4x5 film, was flexible and fun to use. though it could be stressful at times how long composing a shot could take. that was mostly because it was close to storm-like winds that day(!) I was always worried about losing my cloth to the winds

anyhow, it was exciting and though! being totally new to benbo tripods didn't help either haha~ but I had two good guys help me out and get to know the gear and process.

I'm surprised how sharp these are considering it was almost storm-like wind that day. specially out on the rocks!!
so without further ado, some results:

They're looking pretty good Jonas! I guess the uneven development is due to the tray system... nevertheless they're great pictures!

When I didn't have my Epson V700 I used to scan my 4x5 negs in two parts and then stitch in PS, just a sugggestion...

Phil Bebbington · « **Reply #20 on:** September 13, 2012, 10:23:40 PM »

Great stuff, Jonas. I wish I was as proactive as you are

jojonas~ · « **Reply #21 on:** September 14, 2012, 08:14:28 PM »

aw, phil

thanks both of you~
if anyone's interested, I've got 1300 x 1600 versions on my flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jonasfx/tags/4x5/

mauricio: but stitching is so much wooork haha! I think at the mo' this might be too much work for me medium format is a decent amount of work that makes it pleasurable for me atleast. if I get a larger enlarger I can imagine going up to 6x7 or 6x9 (besides the occasional pinhole there)

sapata · « **Reply #22 on:** September 14, 2012, 08:29:10 PM »

Quote from: jojonas~ on September 14, 2012, 08:14:28 PM

aw, phil

mauricio: but stitching is so much wooork haha! I think at the mo' this might be too much work for me medium format is a decent amount of work that makes it pleasurable for me atleast. if I get a larger enlarger I can imagine going up to 6x7 or 6x9 (besides the occasional pinhole there)

I know... it only worth doing if you really need, the amount of details you get from a 4x5 neg is just amazing!

I used to scan all my 120 film with my Epson 35mm film scanner, a real pain but I had no choice at back at the time

jojonas~ · « **Reply #23 on:** September 14, 2012, 09:05:53 PM »

mauricio, you are an inspiration to lazier souls :')
I had a hp flatbed scanner before that could scan one framed positive or two frames from a cut of 35mm film (scanning frames long cuttings were pure horror for me then!). I think I scanned one or two frames of medium format before giving up entirely

sapata · « **Reply #24 on:** September 14, 2012, 09:51:27 PM »

Quote from: jojonas~ on September 14, 2012, 09:05:53 PM

mauricio, you are an inspiration to lazier souls :')
I had a hp flatbed scanner before that could scan one framed positive or two frames from a cut of 35mm film (scanning frames long cuttings were pure horror for me then!). I think I scanned one or two frames of medium format before giving up entirely

... the things we do when we're younger...

Not sure if I'd have this patience again if I needed

DS · « **Reply #25 on:** September 17, 2012, 08:17:11 AM »

These are top Jonas.

Scanning- try scanning as a print with a mirror on top of the film so it reflects the light from the scan head back through the neg to the CCD. It works OK- not as good as a dedicated LF flatbed, but OK for a preview.

jojonas~ · « **Reply #26 on:** September 17, 2012, 08:52:39 AM »

DS: that's an interesting trick. I'll keep my eyes out for a mirror of the right size. thanks!

Ed Wenn · « **Reply #27 on:** September 17, 2012, 02:01:48 PM »

Yeah, nice work, Jonas. These make a great start. Good to see you mixing it up a bit too with landscapes and portraits.

Francois · « **Reply #28 on:** September 17, 2012, 02:52:26 PM »

Quote from: DS on September 17, 2012, 08:17:11 AM

These are top Jonas.

Scanning- try scanning as a print with a mirror on top of the film so it reflects the light from the scan head back through the neg to the CCD. It works OK- not as good as a dedicated LF flatbed, but OK for a preview.

The only thing to watch out for is that the images will appear much denser than in real life...

But I'll have to try this out... I'm having a brain storm!