Author Topic: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos  (Read 11329 times)

Late Developer

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Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« on: December 13, 2010, 11:26:25 PM »
After a load of trial and (mostly) error yesterday, I've started to come to terms with VueScan and I'm very pleasantly surprised at the ease and quality of the scans I'm getting even at only 2400 dpi. Here's the first few - taken on a very rainy day in Keswick, using the Hassy 500c/m and Distagon 60mm CT* f3.5 and Fuji Acros 100 film.

There's little manipulation in Photoshop other than dust . crud and hair removal and then application of a "preset" called "Black and Beautiful" which has a pink tone to it. Hope you like them.

I'd be interested to see anyone else's scans from this, most stunning, part of the world.
"An ounce of perception. A pound of obscure".

moominsean

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2010, 11:43:31 PM »
looks like he scanner software is making the photos a little soft, which may be from the "dust and scratch" auto removal, which i always avoid. it tends to remove quite a bit of detail. phil was having a similar issue in his scans, but he seems to have fixed the issue. contrast is a bit high as well so detail is gone in the bright areas, but that just may be the film or developer. other than that (and the pink doesn't do it for me), looks good, nice start!

just as a quick scanning example, this photo has contrast without losing the detail in the highlights, and the edges remain sharp without looking sharpened (which i think may have been one of the issues with phil's). no jagged edges and smooth tones, even in this compressed jpeg. i find that minimal use of messing about usually makes for the best scans. i use autoexposure initially, unless it blows out the light areas.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2010, 11:52:22 PM by moominsean »
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Phil Bebbington

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2010, 10:15:51 AM »
It can be tedious, but, I always remove dust and scratches manually. I have never had satisfactory results with those kind of auto functions.

LT

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2010, 11:27:46 AM »
Paul is removing the dust in photoshop (there is no auto-filter in Vuescan to do this).  I'd echo the suggestion of doing this manually though - auto settings always end in compromise IMO.

The scans are really clipped at both ends Paul leaving large black shadow tones and featureless highlights.

This could be an issue with your vuescan settings, although equally  may just be your monitor calibration  - I suspect it's the former though as other scans you've posted haven't looked that way. They are also very soft.

I dont think there is any shame in making adjustments in photoshop to get your tonal range right.  I find that Vuescan is great for getting a good scan with lots of detail - but only as an initial stage to be further realised in editing software.

My method with Vuescan is to scan at whatever DPI you like, but make sure 16 bit is selected (if you are in greyscale that is). I do have the sharpen filter selected.  Once I've run the preview, I select the frame I want in the preview pane, then click on the scan pane and press ctrl+E (or in mac cmd+E) to get a large preview. Selecting the colour options, I use the levels sliders in the bottom left hand histogram to ensure the dark and light points are just outside the clip point, then I set the lightness value to what suits the image best - usually .75 for my films.

Next I press the scan button. Once this is done, I double check the histogram clip points again to make sure the software hasn't overridden my settings, then save.

Next I open in photoshop.  Firstly, I apply USM settings at between 75 at 0.75 radius to 150 at 1.5 radius depending on the image resolution. Next I use the auto spot tool to get rid of dust and artefacts. Next I open a levels layer and set the dark and light points (which are invariable slightly flatter than the histogram in vuescan suggest)- if you hold down the alt key whilst doing this, you'll get a clear indication of when you have gone too far.  Next a curves layer to sort out contrast. then feathered selections and curves to sort out any dodging/ burning required.

I then like to flatten and convert the file to RGB 8-bit.  I create a colour balance layer and add tones that way as you can add individual tones to highs mids and shadows - you can be much more subtle than using preset tones, which never quite work IMO and it is much easier than duotoning also i think.  Finally, I resize for web, but then re-sharpen.  My method at this stage is to apply small amounts of sharpening repeatedly until it looks correct - about 30 at 0.3 radius - it usually takes me about three applications depending on the size of the original scan.

that's it.  Hope I'm not teaching you to suck eggs, but I found it really helpful looking at other's workflows before I settled on my own.  Mind you, I only scan for web display - I never do digital prints from my scanned negs.

As for the lakes - here are a few from the past 10 years:

L.

original_ann

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2010, 11:49:00 AM »
Whoa Leon, those scans, those photographs are amazing!  I like hearing about other's scanflows.  Never thought of using color balance layers for tones.  I'll have to try that.  I think I spend the majority of my time (95%) removing dust with a very tiny radius brush.... painstaking click, click, click... for ages without blinking ;)

Paul, I wonder if some of the tones are affected by the "Black and Beautiful" setting? Not to say the setting can't be used, but perhaps it needs to be adjusted once applied? 

Phil Bebbington

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2010, 11:55:03 AM »
Leon, given the quality of your work I'm sure your work flow will assist many here. Great stuff and thank you for typing it all out.

Photo_Utopia

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #6 on: December 14, 2010, 12:39:36 PM »
Leon those are lovely. Scanning is a bit of a 'black art' but as Leon points out if you scan in 16bit and watch your black point and your white point so they don't clip any histogram before scanning, then refine in Photoshop you should be ballpark OK.
Mark
PS
I'd like to thank Leon for putting up his workflow too, and agree totally about adding colour to your greyscale scans this will give them a little more zap as greyscale images can look flat, I used to go the custom duotone route and adjust them with individual curves which as Leon says is hard (probably unessesarily so)
Just adding a little yellow say +10Y and possibly -2Cyan will often be enough.
Here is a 'Record Rapid' Duotone:
« Last Edit: December 14, 2010, 12:54:06 PM by Photo_Utopia »
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Francois

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2010, 03:49:20 PM »
Don't forget to ask Vuescan to save the images as a format compatible with high bit depth (like TIFF). Jpeg will crunch everything to 8 bit.

If you're shooting a C-41 processed film, choosing Infrared dust removal does a wonderful job.

As for removing dust manually, my mom bought me what is probably the best tool ever: a Wacom Bamboo tablet. Mine is a pen & touch model... though the trackpad feature is mostly annoying. The lower cost pen only version would have been enough. And since the prices on them is dropping, it's a good choice (ask Santa?)
Francois

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LT

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2010, 03:58:38 PM »
Francois - thanks for that - I never knew about Jpeg not supporting 16 bit.  I always save in Tiff anyway, but it's good to know for future reference.

Re dust removal ... where in vuescan is the infrared dust removal?  It's not listed on my version? (9.0.06)

L.

Phil Bebbington

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2010, 05:01:11 PM »
I have always used the Epson Scan software - I think I will have to take a look at this.

Suzi Livingstone

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2010, 05:25:45 PM »
Leon & Photo U those are stunning.

I have a a bit of a slap dash approach to scanning and unfortunately it shows a lot of the time. I hope to upgrade to a better scanner next year & sort it out, or try to anyway.

Francois

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #11 on: December 14, 2010, 08:58:00 PM »
Francois - thanks for that - I never knew about Jpeg not supporting 16 bit.  I always save in Tiff anyway, but it's good to know for future reference.

Re dust removal ... where in vuescan is the infrared dust removal?  It's not listed on my version? (9.0.06)
When you select transparency mode with lots of detail (press the more button), you'll find it under filter... but it might have moved since I'm using an older version of the program.
Francois

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Ed Wenn

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #12 on: December 14, 2010, 09:19:32 PM »
FWIW I've been using Leon's workflow for scanning b/w negs for about 5 years now (ever since the last time he posted it on a forum in fact :D) and it's worked wonders for my end product. Unless I get The Boy Druid himself or someone similarly gifted to print my negs properly in a darkroom, I always use the scanner/P'shop/digital print service to end up with a finished print, so being able to use P'Shop properly is really important to me and I'd like to thank The Druid for sharing his workflow all those years ago (and again today).

Phil: I've never used Vuescan. So stick with the Epson software if you're happy with it. You can still do all the other P'shop stuff Leon mentions.

Francois: When scanning 16-bit b/w I always save as .PSD format, figuring that that's as good as TIFF. I then convert to 8-bit for Web display as JPG. Please don't tell me I'm wrong.

LT

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #13 on: December 14, 2010, 09:59:57 PM »
Francois - thanks for that - I never knew about Jpeg not supporting 16 bit.  I always save in Tiff anyway, but it's good to know for future reference.

Re dust removal ... where in vuescan is the infrared dust removal?  It's not listed on my version? (9.0.06)
When you select transparency mode with lots of detail (press the more button), you'll find it under filter... but it might have moved since I'm using an older version of the program.

i do vaguely remember it now I see your screen shot F. I think it's a long gone feature though. I haven't seen it in vuescan for a long time. It's certainly not in the current version.
L.

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #14 on: December 14, 2010, 10:19:06 PM »
It might be due to the fact that standard B&W negatives don't work with infrared cleaning.

Maybe the new program takes this into account and disables it when you ask for a B&W scan. If that's the case, it should work if you scan the image as color and then desaturate in photoshop.


And Ed, PSD files are just as good as tiff... so you're right :)
Francois

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LT

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2010, 11:02:36 PM »
Maybe the new program takes this into account and disables it when you ask for a B&W scan. If that's the case, it should work if you scan the image as color and then desaturate in photoshop.


nope - it's not there for colour neg or positive scan settings. 
L.

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2010, 11:23:17 PM »
Firstly - and to everyone - thank you so much for your words of encouragement and advice. I am a novice when it comes to most digital manipulation. I have CS3 but I wouldn't know where to start when it comes to "opening levels layers" and such things - although I will have to learn if the quality of my output is to get close to that posted by Moominsean, Photo Utopia and Leon.

I only ever do dust removal at full pixel size in Photoshop. "Digital Ice" only works on chromogenic film, as far as I'm aware and I can do the work a lot faster than Digital Ice can do it as part of a scan.

I tend to do very little sharpening. On images taken with my DSLR (Nikon D700) I use small doses of "High Pass Filter" wherever possible as it doesn't introduce weird artefacts and never looks over-sharpened or gritty. Also, I only ever sharpen those elements in the photo that are critically sharp - what's the point in trying to sharpen the blurred bits?? With film, I find that sharpening can increase the appearance of grain - so I'm equally careful when sharpening scans.

Stylistically, I don't mind losing a bit of shadow or highlight detail if that's the way that I remember seeing the photo. My pet hate is a digital technique referred to as "HDR". Done well, you can't tell the technique has been employed. Done averagely or badly, and everything looks surreal. However, Moominsean is spot on with his comments on my photos, though. I will have another go and see if I can create something with a bit more balance.

For those who haven't used Lightroom yet, it is worth having a play with. It's a great RAW converter and workflow tool. Presets can be a very useful shortcut to a certain "look" you're trying to achieve - although it's all but impossible to get it 100% right just by applying a preset on its own.

Overall, I think Ed's comment about getting the Photoshop skills up to speed are the key when using a hybrid process. So, I'll have to start reading the CS3 bible that sits looking at me on my bookshelf. I knew it would come in handy one day.....
« Last Edit: December 14, 2010, 11:24:59 PM by Late Developer »
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Phil Bebbington

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2010, 11:49:27 PM »
Ed, you are right about Leon's black and white work-flow, he shared it with me a while back and it made life so much easier. Yeah, Epson Scan has always served me okay - I will have a play with the free version of Vuescan when I next scan although I have always been reluctant to do any adjustment within the scan software, I have always done it all in Photoshop.

Ed Wenn

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #18 on: December 15, 2010, 12:38:07 AM »
Right you are, Phil. I used to do the auto levels thing in Silverfast Ai and then latterly in Epson Scan to give me a good starting point, but when Leon showed me what he did it turned it all on its head and from then on I changed my approach totally. Now I go for an initial scan which has all the information (i.e. typically quite grey and flat-looking) and then bring out the bits I need using levels and curves.

moominsean

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2010, 01:33:47 AM »
i agree with adding a bit of color with "color balance". i often add 5 red and 5 yellow just to add a bit of warmth without making the photo sepia.

i'm slowly reading through all of these responses that suddenly appeared. it does take a lot of experimentation to get scanning the way you want it to. i have a lot of experience with scanning and correcting for magazines from my previous job. now i'm kind of a mid-grade scanner at home...i know what works for me but i don't go overboard time-wise.

i use epson scan...since i don't use much beside auto-exposure (mostly for polaroids), doing the rest in photoshop, it does the job just fine.

what i do miss is having a scanner that actually has full glass under the lid instead of a stupid strip the width of 120 film. i'm sure they do this just to make you spend more money for one that does more, though the only difference is the size of the exposed bulb.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2010, 01:36:34 AM by moominsean »
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Pete_R

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #20 on: December 15, 2010, 04:14:15 PM »
Maybe the new program takes this into account and disables it when you ask for a B&W scan. If that's the case, it should work if you scan the image as color and then desaturate in photoshop.


nope - it's not there for colour neg or positive scan settings. 

It only shows up if your scanner has an infra red channel. I'm pretty sure I've seen it but I never use it.
"I've been loading films into spirals for so many years I can almost do it with my eyes shut."

Late Developer

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #21 on: December 15, 2010, 10:11:10 PM »
Okay.............let's see where this goes........

I've had a bit of a rummage through some older negs and found one where I know I used a tripod on a sunnier day and used a relatively slow film (TMax 100). I re-set VueScan and ensured all the grain removal and dust removal settings were off. The scan (3200 dpi) was then dusted in CS3 and I create layers for:

- Contrast and brightness
- highlight and shadow
- sharpening

I added a fraction of warmth in Lightroom 2 as I don't know how to do that using a layer in CS3. I will learn, though.

Anyway, I'm not looking for a pat on the head as I know it's not perfect. However, I think it looks a bit better than the ones I posted last night. Not up to Leon and the other guys' work but better than my previous efforts, I think.
"An ounce of perception. A pound of obscure".

Phil Bebbington

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #22 on: December 15, 2010, 10:22:44 PM »
Ld, much better - the warmth that Leon speaks of is added in colour balance - what ever suits your needs, but, a little red in the shadows and midtones plus a little yellow in the highlights might help.

Late Developer

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #23 on: December 15, 2010, 10:43:32 PM »
Thanks Phil.

I've worked out how to get to colour balance (greyed out until I changed from greyscale to RGB - obvious once I'd thought about it, d'oh!!)

Here's the final version with a thin black border to finish it off.
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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #24 on: December 15, 2010, 10:58:16 PM »
Paul, it's a learning curve for us all. I guess that's what makes this place so great.

LT

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2010, 11:05:04 PM »
Now you're talking!

Still a touch soft for my tastes, but much better.

Just picking up on what you said about only sharpening your digi images selectively because what's the point of sharpening blur (I'm assuming you apply this logic to your film scans)  ... Don't forget that you are sharpening to counteract the scanners focus (or lack of), not the inherrent sharpness of the neg itself so I consider it necessary to apply a USM overall. It should only turn out to be excessive and grain expanding if you start to try to compensate for a soft negative too. Given that you are using Zeiss lenses, that should definitely nor be necessary!

 

  
L.

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #26 on: December 16, 2010, 12:48:00 AM »
just a quick messabout in photoshop, 25% unsharp mask to reduce the softness, some adjustment of curves and a bit of warmth added. just to show what you can do with ps in a minute or so...

there is defnly a difference in the image posted her compared to what i see in photoshop. must be because of some web based color profile or some such. but there isn't the same glow around the tree until posted here.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2010, 12:52:02 AM by moominsean »
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Mojave

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #27 on: December 16, 2010, 01:50:57 AM »
Gorgeous images Leon, and thank you for the work flow. Can I ask why you dont do digital prints of scanned negatives? Thats pretty much all I can do without a darkroom. Im guessing you must have a real darkroom and that is why, but I thought I'd ask just be sure.

Thanks!
mojave

LT

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #28 on: December 16, 2010, 07:03:10 AM »
Gorgeous images Leon, and thank you for the work flow. Can I ask why you dont do digital prints of scanned negatives? Thats pretty much all I can do without a darkroom. Im guessing you must have a real darkroom and that is why, but I thought I'd ask just be sure.

Thanks!

thanks Erin - I don't do digi printing because I do real printing. Why settle for glass when you can have diamonds?
 
 ;)

*raises shields and wait for rotten tomatoes to stop flying in my general direction*

sean - I did the same thing with same results when tried to post it here. I think the image is a little too large for the forum software so a bit of auto resizing/compression at play here.
  
« Last Edit: December 16, 2010, 09:29:10 AM by leon taylor »
L.

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #29 on: December 16, 2010, 10:38:42 AM »
Late Developer, your last effort is well on the way.
About sharpening, I always sharpen as a last step so if I resize for web use I'll be making an image just for web, sharpening is different for print. Most film scans need sharpening because scaning (especially on a flatbed) softens the image. Film and digital must be treated very differently in this respect.

I prefer to do two types of sharpening one where the amount (top) is quite low 15-30 and the radius is quite high say 25-60 (depending on the size of the image). This type of sharpening gives a 'pop' in contrast, the secret is to look at the white/dark areas for halo artifacts if you see them just back off or increase the threashold.

The second type is normally quite mild where the radius is 1-2 and the amount 50 or so (sometimes less depending on size) this makes fine detail look sharper but can also give artifacts that can enhance grain.

Each image will need slightly different values, subject and size of file will dictate those to a large degree.
The idea is to make it look as if no processing or sharpening have been done, the image below has had both types of sharpening.
Mark Antony
There's more to this photography thing than meets the eye.

Late Developer

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #30 on: December 16, 2010, 01:23:41 PM »
Mark Anthony,

"I prefer to do two types of sharpening one where the amount (top) is quite low 15-30 and the radius is quite high say 25-60 (depending on the size of the image). This type of sharpening gives a 'pop' in contrast, the secret is to look at the white/dark areas for halo artifacts if you see them just back off or increase the threshold."

When you say this, do you mean a pixel radius of 25-60? I usually use a top "amount" of 75-80% and then nothing more than a 1.0 pixel radius. More commonly, my pixel radius is in the range of 0.3 to 0.8. That's probably as a result of being more used to sharpening digital files - which seem to respond very badly to using a high pixel radius.

I always sharpen last - just before re-sizing for posting on the web. If I use Lightroom 2 to sharpen, it offers me the option to sharpen for web or for prints. I choose whichever is appropriate. If I sharpen in CS3, I use either the "high pass" filter method or "smart sharpen". High pass filter is a lot smoother and doesn't seem to cause over-sharpening unless you really go wild with it. Smart sharpen is a quicker option and a lot less aggressive than USM when it comes to halos and all the associated artefacts that over-sharpening brings with it.

I'll have a go at your method when I get home (currently on lunch break) and see how I get on.

Leon, I wish I still had my darkroom, too. However, I'd still have to learn how to sharpen for the web....

"An ounce of perception. A pound of obscure".

Photo_Utopia

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #31 on: December 16, 2010, 07:22:23 PM »
Yes I mean higher pixel radius combined with lower amount, this will give what I call a 'contrast sharpen'.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2010, 07:28:01 PM by Photo_Utopia »
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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #32 on: December 16, 2010, 07:32:35 PM »
This is a wonderful thread! I find the ins and outs of everyone's work flow is fascinating.

Late Developer

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #33 on: December 16, 2010, 07:59:16 PM »
Thanks Mark Anthony. I'm going to have a play with that technique and see how it works on my stuff. It looks like a really interesting technique.

Phil - me too. I learn new stuff every time I visit the site and I don't mind admitting it. In fact, where's the shame in saying "I don't know how to do this"?

One or two sites that I've joined in the past have had some members who play the politics of the school yard - trying to bully you into their sense of right and conformity. Here, you guys seem happy to share information and that's a very useful and liberating feeling for someone only just coming to terms with scanning.

"An ounce of perception. A pound of obscure".

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #34 on: December 16, 2010, 08:04:57 PM »
I totally agree with Phil - and I'm feeling QUITE inadequate! ;))

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #35 on: December 16, 2010, 08:06:23 PM »
... and Paul - I so agree with you - FW are a generous and thoughtful bunch. 

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #36 on: December 16, 2010, 08:12:21 PM »
Right then, here goes.....

This is the latest iteration - having "contrast sharpened" as recommended by Photo Utopia. I must say that this has worked a lot better than I imagined it might. I opened up the TIFF file, converted to 16 bit, ran the USM at (Amount) 25% (Radius) 65% (Threshold) 0% and then Smart Sharpened using (Amount) 80% (Radius 1%) and (Threshold) 0%

Otherwise unchanged. Seems to have a bit more "punch" than the previous one and there's no apparent grittiness I can see.
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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #37 on: December 16, 2010, 08:36:21 PM »
One last one....

A 35mm neg scanned a while ago. I've sharpened as above and applied a bit of a warm colour balance.
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Nigel

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #38 on: December 16, 2010, 08:45:06 PM »
I have to admit sharpening is one of those things I've steered away from as I've never really understood it properly. To make matters more complicated I use Aperture, which I haven't had very long and I love, but the ranges of the various sliders are different.  ???

There are two types of sharpening on offer 'Sharpen' & 'Edge Sharpen' - nope means nothing to me.

Are there any other Aperture users out there who could shed a little light?
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Francois

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #39 on: December 16, 2010, 10:12:19 PM »
Not an Aperture user... not even a Mac user (yes, I stick with old Windoze XP for now).

But on the photoshop side, I'm still a fan of LAB sharpening when it comes to large images (I wrote a thread about it years ago which is here). It's basically an unsharp mask applied only to the Lightness channel of the image. The ratios for the unsharp mask are fixed by the number of DPI the image has and your personal tastes.

Seems to avoid making the image too sharp yet increases sharpness... hard to explain until you try it out. I made an action out of it so it's faster to apply.
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Photo_Utopia

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #40 on: December 16, 2010, 10:39:56 PM »
François
I use that on my noisy digital photo's sometimes (800ISO+) I also blur the colour channels to get rid of chroma noise (yuk)
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Urban Hafner

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #41 on: December 17, 2010, 02:13:54 PM »
There are two types of sharpening on offer 'Sharpen' & 'Edge Sharpen' - nope means nothing to me.

Are there any other Aperture users out there who could shed a little light?

I use Aperture, too. And I even have a book about it. Can you remind me again in a few days? There's a section on sharpening in there that I will try to read and summarize for you (and learn about sharpening myself in the process).

Urban

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #42 on: December 17, 2010, 03:57:30 PM »
Quote
I use Aperture, too. And I even have a book about it. Can you remind me again in a few days? There's a section on sharpening in there that I will try to read and summarize for you (and learn about sharpening myself in the process).

Urban

Urban - that's very good of you. I'd be interested to know what book you have and whether you recommend it? I feel as though as I'm not making the most of Aperture at the moment.
thanks Nigel.
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Urban Hafner

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #43 on: December 17, 2010, 04:39:26 PM »
Urban - that's very good of you. I'd be interested to know what book you have and whether you recommend it? I feel as though as I'm not making the most of Aperture at the moment.
thanks Nigel.

That's true. Aperture has so many functions. On every page of the book I learn something new (not that I've read the whole book). However, my book is on Aperture 2 so even though it's good I wouldn't recommend it.

Urban

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #44 on: December 19, 2010, 10:04:45 PM »
I have to admit sharpening is one of those things I've steered away from as I've never really understood it properly. To make matters more complicated I use Aperture, which I haven't had very long and I love, but the ranges of the various sliders are different.  ???

There are two types of sharpening on offer 'Sharpen' & 'Edge Sharpen' - nope means nothing to me.

Are there any other Aperture users out there who could shed a little light?


According to my book Sharpening is like Unsharp Mask. It looks for areas of high contrast in your image -- because a high-contrast area is usually an edge -- and then it darkens the pixels along the dark side of the edge and lightens the pixels along the light side of the edge. This makes the edge appear to have higher contrast, and therefore looks sharper. The Intensity slider lets you specify how much of this lightening and darkening you want applied to an edge, although the Radius slider lets you control how thick the brightened and darkened areas will be.

Aperture's Edge Sharpen controls group lets you apply subtle sharpening effects to only the edge in your images. A much more subtle effect than the normal Sharpen adjustment, Edge Sharpen is particularly effective when used on portraits [...] Edge Sharpen searches for edges by identifying areas of sudden contrast change. Edge Sharpen provides three controls: Intensity, Edges, and Falloff. Intensity controls the strength of the effect. Edges lets you control how strong a contrast change must be before Aperture considers it an edge. Falloff controls how the effect transitions between sharpened and non-sharpened areas.

I'm not sure if that help you much. Everything more than that is just playing around with the controls, I guess.

Urban

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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #45 on: December 21, 2010, 08:00:37 PM »
Urban - thank you very much for doing that, that's an awful lot of typing! I think I understand it a bit better. I'll have to play with an image and see if I can see the difference between the two. (and buy a book!)

Thanks again.
Nigel
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Re: Derwent Water - my first VueScan photos
« Reply #46 on: December 22, 2010, 10:22:35 PM »
I've been having a bit of a play with VueScan using some negs I took a couple of years ago (Kodak 400TX) at Liverpool Street Station using my old M6/Summicron 35/f2

The sharpening was the issue I've tried to get right. I used the same regime as previously and I'm getting happier with the technique all the time.

Thanks to everyone for their help and patience on this. I know it's not perfect yet but it's a big contrast from my earlier efforts.

"An ounce of perception. A pound of obscure".