Author Topic: Leica troubles (Read 6229 times)

choppert · « **on:** November 15, 2009, 07:44:09 PM »

Guys

I'm in crisis.

A few years ago I managed to buy a mint M6 and now have a couple of nice lenses for it.

I keep getting tempted with the idea of selling it and buying a Mamiya 6.

Larger neg, more flexibility with faster films, pretty much as compact as the Leica, better flash sync, blah blah blah.

I love the M6 and would probably regret getting rid of it, but certainly can't justify the two. I'll be wanting enlargements up to about 11x16 or A3, no poster size prints!!!!

Should I just pin my ears back and carry on enjoying the Leica or sell it while it's still in great condition and make the most out of it?

Has anyone any experience of the Mamiya? Any thoughts?

Thanks,

Chops

gregor · « **Reply #1 on:** November 15, 2009, 08:35:13 PM »

I'd keep it. Although I shoot almost entirely MF & large format, there's been plenty of times I regretted selling my M3, and trading away my konica hexar since they were both such easy to use and lightweight cary around cameras.

In my downsizing of my camera collection I did some cash/swap for a mint canonet ql17 with Chricel (now the owner of my Bronica SQ-a) , which is good enough for me at this point. However, for a series I'll be working on next spring, the M3 or konica would have been perfect - or maybe the canonet will be just fine: too much emphasis on gear, no?

And despite popular beleif, it's ok not to be square or MF...

[Sorry, image deleted during forum software upgrade. Please re-upload if so inclined.]

LT · « **Reply #2 on:** November 15, 2009, 08:53:02 PM »

I have a mamiya 6 and i L-O-V-E it. But bear in mind the 6MultiFormat (last model that included a strange 35mm size panoramic frame on 120 film) was discontinued in 1997 so the newest models will be at least 12 years old already which for an electronic camera is risky. As they get older, they will be more prone to problems and there is no supply of off-the-shelf spares to repair them - I doubt camera repairers will have a steady supply of broken bodies to strip for spares, whereas I expect your m6 would be much easier to get sorted in a crisis. Also, the Mam 6 shutter is entirely battery dependent, I'm not up on leica specs but I dont think your M6 will be.

The mamiya 6 lenses are stupendously bitingly sharp. Their resolution is reportedly comparable with 5x4 and, to my eye, this is very possibly true.

Stepping up from 35mm to 6x6 is a big step though ... if you're certain the square is for you then that is fine, but if you are used to the rectangle, why not look for a mamiya 7?

My experience of selling cameras to get to the next step has always ended in me regretting selling off my old gear. I know the economic climate is tight, but if you can, it would be much better to keep hold of your leica and save for the mamiya? then, if you find you are using the leica less, then you can sell it knowing you are happy with what you have.

The only bad thing about the camera is the meter under exposes by about a stop on mine, especially if the sky is bright (the metering is done through the viewfinder, not ttl,) but I just slow down the film speed setting or add a stop on the exposure compensation . It is rock solid and build to take knocks.

hookstrapped · « **Reply #3 on:** November 15, 2009, 09:58:21 PM »

DON'T DO IT!

I have a M2 and also want a Mamiya 6, but I'm still in my grainy phase so smaller is good for me.

Francois · « **Reply #4 on:** November 15, 2009, 10:21:44 PM »

Before getting rid of your Leica, if you want very fine grain, you should first try and get your hands on some GigabitFilm. You might surprised at what you can get out of your Leica.

And if you decide on getting rid of it, I'm always open to free stuff from Germany

Pete_R · « **Reply #5 on:** November 15, 2009, 10:37:15 PM »

Quote from: choppert on November 15, 2009, 07:44:09 PM

Larger neg, more flexibility with faster films, pretty much as compact as the Leica, better flash sync, blah blah blah.

I love the M6 and would probably regret getting rid of it, but certainly can't justify the two. I'll be wanting enlargements up to about 11x16 or A3, no poster size prints!!!!

Larger neg? - Yes

More flexibility with faster films? - What's the maximum aperture of the lenses? You might find you can do just as much with the Leica with a slower film due to the larger maximum apertures.

As compact as a Leica? - No

Better flash sync? - Does the Leica sync with a flash? Do you have a brain? Then you don't need anything else.

Enlargements to 11x16? - From a Leica - no problem.

Now why do you want a Mam 6?

moominsean · « **Reply #6 on:** November 15, 2009, 11:21:19 PM »

medium and large format is fine, but i would still want to have one decent 35mm camera...

rdbkorn · « **Reply #7 on:** November 16, 2009, 01:54:44 AM »

I also have a Mamiya 6, which I love. The three lenses are extraordinarily sharp. It does weigh a fair bit more than my Bessa 35mm rangefinder, though.

I think Leon's raised a good point about the square format - not everyone's a fan. Before selling off the Leica and getting stuck in with a Mamiya 6, I would suggest buying a....Holga! It comes with both 6X6 and 6X4.5 masks so you can familiarize yourself with 120 film and the two negative sizes for about 1-2% of the cost of a complete Mamiya 6 kit (body and 3 lenses). Then once you know whether you like square or rectangular format, you can trade up.

Paul

gregor · « **Reply #8 on:** November 16, 2009, 02:57:41 AM »

Oh yes, the Mamiya. I've shot with the RB67, 6, Six, and 7 as well as the Universal Press (6x7 & pola back). They're all lovely cameras. But I have this thing about batteries. They mess with my sense of right & wrong !

Consider a MF folder: Zeiss Ikon Ikonta, Agfa folders, Bessas or Certos.

Not only do they take beautiful shots, their weight and flexibility in all lighting situations is hard to beat.

In fact, shoot me an e-mail. I have a bessa 66 (baby bessa) collecting dust.....

gregor · « **Reply #9 on:** November 16, 2009, 08:05:03 AM »

LOL - it's just a leica: a fancy red logo with a big price tag. dump it by sending it to me. that'll take the burden off your shoulders and you can get a Mamiya, Bronica rf645, or whatever the heck you want !!

Nigel · « **Reply #10 on:** November 16, 2009, 08:41:52 AM »

Chops

Don't do it!

So many times I've sold gear because 'I was over it' and then for all the reasons you bought it in the first place you'll want it again.

A Leica is for life, not just for Christmas.

Stu · « **Reply #11 on:** November 16, 2009, 09:27:29 AM »

Leica are the best 35mm cameras in my opinion.
Don't do it.

salvo · « **Reply #12 on:** November 16, 2009, 10:01:53 AM »

... or you could swap it for another Leica? kind of upgrade

http://www.bjp-online.com/public/showPage.html?page=870972

choppert · « **Reply #13 on:** November 16, 2009, 10:52:33 AM »

Thanks for the input guys.
I've a Bronica SLR, and yes the square format drives me nuts.
The Mamiya 6 looks very slimline when the lens is retracted and while the lenses are a bit slower than the Leica lenses (about a stop) I rarely shoot wide open anyway (shabby focussing on my part!) and the thought of getting nice sharp enlargements with 400 ISO film seems awfully tempting. It's more extra film speed I want, rather than uber-fine grain.
The Mamiya 7 looks cheaper, is a bit more modern and has a larger neg - but it looks a bit too bulky for me. Anyone use one?

I predominantly wander the streets shooting, rather than lug tripods around so quicker film is of most interest.

I suppose another thing to consider is the handholding minimum shutter speed. I've snapped away at 1/15 and with a bit of wedging against the wall even 1/8. (and yes, I know focal length is more the issue here) but if the Mamiya is heavier it may be a bit more tricky?

LT · « **Reply #14 on:** November 16, 2009, 12:05:38 PM »

Actually, I find it easier to hand hold the Mamiya 6 than I do my bessa r3a. It's ergonomic design and size seem to make it much easier. I'm a crap at hand held low shutter speeds at the best of time, but 1/15 is relatively easy with the mam 6 for me whereas I struggle with 1/30 on the 35mm.

If you are used to square, and you are well aware of the mamiya 6 limits (eg only 3 lenses, increasingly old stock, lack of spares for repair, battery dependant, bellows ageing) then go for it.

Francois · « **Reply #15 on:** November 16, 2009, 03:27:55 PM »

Quote from: leon taylor on November 16, 2009, 12:05:38 PM

Actually, I find it easier to hand hold the Mamiya 6 than I do my bessa r3a. It's ergonomic design and size seem to make it much easier. I'm a crap at hand held low shutter speeds at the best of time, but 1/15 is relatively easy with the mam 6 for me whereas I struggle with 1/30 on the 35mm.

That's simply because you're keeping secret the fact you're a giant with very large hands

Late Developer · « **Reply #16 on:** January 20, 2011, 01:31:42 PM »

Hi Chops.

I don't want to be a doom-monger but I still think you'll miss the M6. I had one and loved it until i got completely psyched-out with the load / unload method. But then I'm a clumsy oaf. The photos were great and it was a really stealthy piece of kit.

You won't be disappointed with the Mamiya 6 or Mamiya 7 quality-wise (I had a 7) but you might notice the loss of a couple of aperture stops.

Do I miss my M6? Of course I do.

Paul.

choppert · « **Reply #17 on:** January 20, 2011, 01:45:15 PM »

About six months ago I bought a Nikon 35Ti, and I can safely (yet ashamedly) say the auto everything on it is so much better than me and my eyes!

The negs are better exposed and better focussed - which is just about all you need from a camera

I eventually bought a Mamiya 7 and think the Mamiya and Nikon combination will do for the future.

I know I'll regret selling the Leica, I saved for long enough, but the head has to rule the heart!

sapata · « **Reply #18 on:** January 20, 2011, 06:05:27 PM »

Quote from: Francois on November 15, 2009, 10:21:44 PM

Before getting rid of your Leica, if you want very fine grain, you should first try and get your hands on some GigabitFilm. You might surprised at what you can get out of your Leica.

And if you decide on getting rid of it, I'm always open to free stuff from Germany

Francois,

I've never heard about this film, did you have any good experience?
The site seems to be a bit out dated, like the suplier in UK has gone out of bussiness (i guess) a long time ago and some of the informations are dating 2004.

Francois · « **Reply #19 on:** January 20, 2011, 09:04:09 PM »

I've never used it but from what I could see around the internet, it looked quite promising.
I especially liked the fact it came with its own developer which is optimized for ultra fine grain.

hookstrapped · « **Reply #20 on:** January 21, 2011, 11:50:39 PM »

I have an M2 and now have a Mamiya 6. I love both.

The Mamiya surprises me as to how wonderfully easy to handle it is. The thing about it is 12 exposures, and changing film isn't as quick as I'd like. But I'm trying to move away from my real grainy phase...