Topic: the death of POP

[kuru]

After seeing an email about POP while cleaning out some mail boxes, I decided to see if there was more available yet. Sad to see this on the  Chicago Albumen Works page:

Despite assurances from a year ago, we regret to report that Harman Technology (the company that bought and shut down the Kentmere production facility in December, 2007) has informed us that they will not be able to produce Centennial? printing-out paper.  Unfortunately, in the current economic climate, the cost of procuring the Centennial? POP formula and the R&D required to bring it to market through another manufacturer prohibits us from attempting to re-establish this product.

To our knowledge, there is no POP being manufactured today.  Introduced in Munich in 1884, it has been one of the most long-lived printing products in the history of photography.

We thank you for supporting our efforts to maintain POP over the last 2 decades, and we are sorry that Centennial? will no longer be available to you.

Chicago Albumen Works
1/8/09

http://www.albumenworks.com/printing-out-paper.html

[Francois]

It's Ed that will be knocked down off his chair...

[cmdrray]

Photographer's Formulary makes a Printing Out Process kit. Yes, you have to coat your own paper...
Their website is photoformulary.com. You can also get the kit from www.freestylephoto.biz

[Ed Wenn]

Reaction to initial post = Gah!

 

..but I actually like the idea of working for my prints, so Commander Ray's post has saved the day somewhat:

Photographer's Formulary makes a Printing Out Process kit. Yes, you have to coat your own paper...
Their website is photoformulary.com. You can also get the kit from www.freestylephoto.biz

I get knocked down, but I get up again.

[LT]

Despite CAW's declaration, Harman Technology's position is that they do still hope to resurrect Printing Out Paper but the transition of the Kentmere formula from the old plant coating machine to the Mobberly plant machine is proving to be problematic.  Also, it seems that the formula used needs a fair bit of revision to meet up to date Health & Safety standards (not sure how Kentmere were getting away with it before). This has aparently forced Harman into a position of not being able to guarantee the paper's revival. Not overly hopeful, but also not an outright end to the paper.   

[LT]

Ed, if you're going as far as self coating your own POP
, you might as well jump in head first and go for some Plat/Palad. Much nicer in my opinion, and got to be easier than brushing on emulsion. Seemed pretty straightforward when I did a bit with mr carl "wetplate" radford.

[Francois]

There's also carbon prints. It comes in pre-coated sheets and gives awesome results from what I've seen in magazines.

[Ed Wenn]

Ed, if you're going as far as self coating your own POP
, you might as well jump in head first and go for some Plat/Palad. Much nicer in my opinion, and got to be easier than brushing on emulsion. Seemed pretty straightforward when I did a bit with mr carl "wetplate" radford.

Thanks, Leon. Truth is I'm not even going so far as to take my own photos at the moment so I won't be self-coating anything for a few years I'm sure...however when that happy day does arrive I'll be sure to try platinum as I too think the results look incredible.

Francois: I need to look into those carbon prints you mention. Intriguing.

[Francois]

Here's the little story behind carbon pigment process prints:

Carbon prints are one of the oldest print making processes. Introduced in 1864 by a British inventor, the process was used until the 1950's. The process consists of a contact printed image made out of carbon pigment suspended in gelatin and deposited on a paper surface. The final print has surface relief, very long tonal scale, perfectly linear density curve. It is available in a variety of tones and colors, and is as permanent as the paper you put it on. It won't fade with time.

The negative is contact printed with a sensitized sheet of transfer paper under UV light. This causes the gelatin to harden in proportion to the amount of light received. Once exposed, the transfer paper is washed briefly in cold water and then squeegeed on the receiving surface (which can be anything). After about 30 minutes, the sandwich is transferred to warm water (43C) to melt the gelatin so you can peel the transfer paper off. The unhardened gelatin will slowly wash away leaving a relief surface.

So there you have it... there are kits available from Bostick & Sullivan.

[Ed Wenn]

Cheers Francois. It does indeed sound fascinating. I've been reading up on the subject & the process is right up my street. This thread on the Ilford forums was particularly good http://www.ilfordphoto.com/photocommunity/forums/theforum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6800

[kuru]

I found a whole site bostick & sullivan has devoted to it today:

http://www.carbonprinting.com/

and the forum they run:

http://bostick-sullivan.invisionzone.com/

[Francois]

I don't know if it's because there is a peel apart component to it or simply because the image look like charcoal drawings... but it does look amazing.

[outofcontxt]

Just my luck. I've just started getting into alt processes. Thankfully, there's the Photographer's Formulary kit. Same thing happened when I was just ready to jump into Polaroid 55. Damn.

[outofcontxt]

cmdrray, I just looked at both sites and didn't find the printing out process kit. Could you provide a direct link for the kit? Thanks.

Ed, you also might want to look into the ziatype process. It's a humidity dependent POP process and very easy to use. It uses palladium as the primary metal and has the capability to produce different tonalities depending on the dop count of the chemicals. You can get a kit from Bostick and Sullivan. As soon as I finish my paper tests with cyanotypes, I'll be jumping head first into ziatypes as well. Here's a link on the process:

http://www.alternativephotography.com/process_ziatype.html

[cmdrray]

The direct URL for Bostick and Sullivan's POP (Salted Paper) Kit is:
http://www.bostick-sullivan.com/cart/product.php?productid=1038&cat=348&page=1

[Ed Wenn]

As soon as I finish my paper tests with cyanotypes, I'll be jumping head first into ziatypes as well. Here's a link on the process:

http://www.alternativephotography.com/process_ziatype.html

Bill, thanks for the tip. Just as soon as you have something worth showing, you be sure to bring it here and let us check it out. Sounds great.

Also...how about showing us those cyantotypes you're doing?

[Francois]

There's also the good old Diazo process... this might be somewhat more to your liking.
Instructables
The only drawbacks is that there is no real way to fix the images... so they will just fade over time.

But on the plus side, it is fast, easy and doesn't involve any highly toxic chemicals (perfect when we have young kids running through the house.

[Ed Wenn]

Guys, what is this http://sciencekit.com/super-sunprintandtrade;-kit/p/IG0027396/ ? Sunprint paper? Anyone have any ideas what's behind the brand? It's not POP because you don't need a fixer & because the image only appears when you wash it.

[Francois]

I tried something similar a long time ago and posted my experiment here...
It's a bit like a cyanotype except you don't need to coat it yourself. The only image I made from it was a real disaster so I haven't played with my remaining sheets...

It's simple and reliable. The problem with the one I made was a contrast issue. I made a high contrast transparency using my laser printer and exposed for an incredibly long time... at least longer than the instructions asked for. I got a tiny bleak image I had to intensify the heck out of using photoshop.

But for the fun factor... it's definitely there.